Church Of Climatology

[Walt Kowalski]

After today's pathetic decsion on an Extra Tax Sytem for Australians, we know for sure that Kevin Rudd and Malcolm Turnbull are both members of the Climate Change Church.

They are fanatical Fundamentalist Mother Earth Worshippers and put their earth worship above everything else.

How did a such Laboral person get to be Leader of the Liberal party?

What hope have we as a Nation with leaders like these two clowns

Only time will tell if they are both members of the One World Government Church after Copenhagen.

Krudd for UN?

[SSD-85]

It's what we have all known all along. "climate change" is just a way of extracting more money out of the populace, and attempting to make us all feel bad in the process. There is so much evidence to dismiss the "climate change" facade it must be someones full time job to stop it from getting out....

[banarcus]

I agree with you 100% Walt.

[rodderz]

Originally Posted by banarcus

After he was voted in, I remember when he proposed a European Union style government for the Pacific and SE Asia.
.

If you believe the rumours it's already on the way. 3 different unions- the European-American Union, the African Union, and the Asia/Pacific Union (APEC) have been created and eventually all merge into one world union. Using the right crisis (in this case global warming) they can use it as a means to create the government

I have an open mind, I don't believe everything I read- but there's some dodgy stuff going on behind closed doors

[Rodp]

Oops, accidently stumbled onto a Politics forum. Looking for the Ford section, anyone know where it is?

[Work Horse]

Originally Posted by Rodp

Oops, accidently stumbled onto a Politics forum. Looking for the Ford section, anyone know where it is?

The bloody government has band it and now all we can talk about is conspiracy theory's

[xy500]

Originally Posted by Rodp

Oops, accidently stumbled onto a Politics forum. Looking for the Ford section, anyone know where it is?

lol, good call
but seriously ets sucks balls

[uranium_death]

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/opinion/...-1225803452749

Bolt gives his view.

To some others, please use a dictionary.

[Walt Kowalski]

THIS THREAD IS NOT ABOUT POLITICS

It is about how our twe major political parties joined forces against the people to remove the freedoms your grandfathers and fathers fought for in WW1 and WW11

If you do not understand that please refrain from flippant remarks. Do some research.

This is the MOST serious thing that has happened to your freedom since WW11.

Sure its not fun like Ford stuff but your children will not have the freedoms you have become accustomed to if these One Worlders continue to get their way.

Democracy in Australia - Yeah right.

[GreenMachine]

Originally Posted by Walt Kowalski

It is about how our twe major political parties joined forces against the people to remove the freedoms your grandfathers and fathers fought for in WW1 and WW11

Can you please explain how my grandfather was fighting for anything to do with this issue? As far as he remembers (I'd back him on this one), he was fighting German fascism and Japanese invasion of Australia.

[King Nothing]

Originally Posted by GreenMachine

Can you please explain how my grandfather was fighting for anything to do with this issue? As far as he remembers (I'd back him on this one), he was fighting German fascism and Japanese invasion of Australia.

I guess what he is trying to argue that our grandfathers fought to maintain the independence of Australia from foreign control (Japanese/Nazi fascism). Now we are facing another threat, but one that isn’t materialised in a military invasion. Instead it is one of economic control.

From what I understand, the Copenhagen agreement basically wants 0.7% of the first world’s GDP (Gross Domestic Product), I’ve read about $7 billion a year, every year, from Australia. This money will be given to the United Nations, where they will do with it what they see fit. Much of this money will be given to third world nations. It will also give the UN the power to punish any country who does not meet reduction targets via more payments to the UN.

The UN or its members and representatives were not elected by anyone in this country. Hence we are handing over a portion of control over our industries and economy to a non-elected governing body. It gives the UN economic power to essentially control how much everything will cost here in Australia.

So I can see the link. Control over our economy is control over our country. Our Grandfathers fought to keep Australia controlled by an elected government. This agreement will take control from our government, and hence our hands as citizens of this country, and place it into a non-democratically determined governing body.

The whole CRU/climategate affair has really thrown a big question mark over the credibility of climate change science. For those who haven’t been following closely, here is basically what has happened;

The East Anglia Climatic Research Unit (CRU) is a government funded, university based research group in the UK. They are a leading body on climate change science and holders of a great deal of climate records (temperatures, rainfall, etc). The data they have and the models they created feature very heavily in the IPCCs report on climate change, which has determined the UN’s and the US EPA’s stance on whether CO2 is a dangerous pollutant and contributor to climate change. This stance is what guides our own government and other around the world on the need to implement an ETS.

The CRU was hacked last week (or possibly leaked from an internal source), and a large amount of emails, data, code and documents were released on the net. From what I have read, and many have commented, (from both pro- and anti- GW scientists) it brings the whole schemozzle into question. Perhaps not whether man made GW is real, but certainly how severe it may be. What has been revealed in these emails and documents are

1. That pro GW scientists colluded together to give a unified view on the impact of GW

2. That these scientists deliberately controlled the peer review process by ensuring that only selected pro-GW scientists would review their papers, that those who attempted to publish anti-GW papers were excluded from the peer review process (and hence excluded from the IPCC report), that the editors of journals which published anti-GW papers were threatened and subsequently removed, essentially creating an environment where only pro-GW papers were peer reviewed. Hence the argument that pro-GW advocates state that the majority of peer reviewed papers support GW

3. That these scientists discussed ways to avoid Freedom of Information requests to keep data to themselves so anti-GW scientists couldn’t review or criticise. They have discussed illegally deleting emails and data to avoid FoI requests, and in fact have lost all their original data on temperature records which were used in the IPCC reports. It now appears that they may have deliberately deleted this data to avoid criticisms.

4. That these scientists have deliberately manipulated data, only shown certain sections of data in graphs, and attempted to remove or alter periods of history (the medieval warming period) that did not agree with their point of view.

5. The existence of the HARRY_READ_ME.txt file and the model code itself. This has not hit the press in a big way just yet, but it exposes a complete lack of control over data, manipulation of data inside the model, complete confusion as to how the model works and what data is being used. This is supposed to be the “gold standard” of climate research, yet it appears they have no idea what is going on.

There’s more to it than that, but there’s a start.

These are the scientists whose work is determining the economic future of the world. Whether or not man made GW is real, the entire IPCC report is now being called into question. Its credibility has been destroyed, and scientists and politicians from both sides are starting to agree only a full and transparent review of the data will absolve the CRU of fraud.

[Walt Kowalski]

Originally Posted by King Nothing

I guess what he is trying to argue that our grandfathers fought to maintain the independence of Australia from foreign control (Japanese/Nazi fascism). Now we are facing another threat, but one that isn’t materialised in a military invasion. Instead it is one of economic control.

From what I understand, the Copenhagen agreement basically wants 0.7% of the first world’s GDP (Gross Domestic Product), I’ve read about $7 billion a year, every year, from Australia. This money will be given to the United Nations, where they will do with it what they see fit. Much of this money will be given to third world nations. It will also give the UN the power to punish any country who does not meet reduction targets via more payments to the UN.

The UN or its members and representatives were not elected by anyone in this country. Hence we are handing over a portion of control over our industries and economy to a non-elected governing body. It gives the UN economic power to essentially control how much everything will cost here in Australia.

So I can see the link. Control over our economy is control over our country. Our Grandfathers fought to keep Australia controlled by an elected government. This agreement will take control from our government, and hence our hands as citizens of this country, and place it into a non-democratically determined governing body.

The whole CRU/climategate affair has really thrown a big question mark over the credibility of climate change science. For those who haven’t been following closely, here is basically what has happened;

The East Anglia Climatic Research Unit (CRU) is a government funded, university based research group in the UK. They are a leading body on climate change science and holders of a great deal of climate records (temperatures, rainfall, etc). The data they have and the models they created feature very heavily in the IPCCs report on climate change, which has determined the UN’s and the US EPA’s stance on whether CO2 is a dangerous pollutant and contributor to climate change. This stance is what guides our own government and other around the world on the need to implement an ETS.

The CRU was hacked last week (or possibly leaked from an internal source), and a large amount of emails, data, code and documents were released on the net. From what I have read, and many have commented, (from both pro- and anti- GW scientists) it brings the whole schemozzle into question. Perhaps not whether man made GW is real, but certainly how severe it may be. What has been revealed in these emails and documents are

1. That pro GW scientists colluded together to give a unified view on the impact of GW

2. That these scientists deliberately controlled the peer review process by ensuring that only selected pro-GW scientists would review their papers, that those who attempted to publish anti-GW papers were excluded from the peer review process (and hence excluded from the IPCC report), that the editors of journals which published anti-GW papers were threatened and subsequently removed, essentially creating an environment where only pro-GW papers were peer reviewed. Hence the argument that pro-GW advocates state that the majority of peer reviewed papers support GW

3. That these scientists discussed ways to avoid Freedom of Information requests to keep data to themselves so anti-GW scientists couldn’t review or criticise. They have discussed illegally deleting emails and data to avoid FoI requests, and in fact have lost all their original data on temperature records which were used in the IPCC reports. It now appears that they may have deliberately deleted this data to avoid criticisms.

4. That these scientists have deliberately manipulated data, only shown certain sections of data in graphs, and attempted to remove or alter periods of history (the medieval warming period) that did not agree with their point of view.

5. The existence of the HARRY_READ_ME.txt file and the model code itself. This has not hit the press in a big way just yet, but it exposes a complete lack of control over data, manipulation of data inside the model, complete confusion as to how the model works and what data is being used. This is supposed to be the “gold standard” of climate research, yet it appears they have no idea what is going on.

There’s more to it than that, but there’s a start.

These are the scientists whose work is determining the economic future of the world. Whether or not man made GW is real, the entire IPCC report is now being called into question. Its credibility has been destroyed, and scientists and politicians from both sides are starting to agree only a full and transparent review of the data will absolve the CRU of fraud.

Thank you.

Saved me doing it and I appreciate it.

Seriously this issue is HUGE.

It is not about politics. It is about FREEDOM and DEMOCRACY which you are about to lose.

It is the thin edge of the wedge for One World Government

I will never vote for either of those two parties again unless there is some sense very quickly and this ETS is squashed before it becomes L A W.

If Rudd signs in Copenhagen we are comitted FOREVER and it does not matter what Australians vote, the UN gets control.

The only way out is if the other developed countries who were stupid enough to sign it as well allow us to leave the agreement combined with the "under developed" countries who would never say no to billions yearly from YOUR TAXES

Put simply, Petrol, Eelctricity, Gas and Food will be at higher prices than you could ever imagine
.
People will lose their jobs by the thousands.

Business will disappear under the extra taxes.

And for what?
NOTHING.

National Party or someone PLEASE RUN IN EVERY ELECTORATE

NO Extra Tax System and Border Control

You will win Government and we can be rid of thsse imposters immediately

It s the only way we will get our democracy back.

[nugget378]

Originally Posted by Walt Kowalski

THIS THREAD IS NOT ABOUT POLITICS

Sorry mate, but lets call a spade a spade..

[TUF_302]

What we need is someone with a passion for cars in charge of the place, A PM thats a Rev Head lol!

[XRQTR]

This is also pretty true, I had an experience last years I think it was with the Dr Karl show on JJJ. They were talking about climate change and global warming and wanted people to ask questions about things they needed answered. Anyway they have a call screening process when they first answer and asked what my question was, I said "I'd like to knwo whether any research has been done on rising seas that could show how much could be attributed to greater stormwater outpoors brought about by increasing urban sprawls worldwide".

She said they'd covered that on a previous show and hung up, thanks ye, nice, I don't bother much with Dr Karl anymore LOL, mind you most of the questions were along the lines of "how bad will it hit us" and "what can we do to stop it?". Not one person put up an alternative view, or should that read, not one person was given the opportunity to put up an alternative view.

But this is on ABC radio, again from Andrew Bolt blog a commentary from an interview :

Originally Posted by ABCRadio

UPDATE 4

Beverley O’Connor fills in for Jon Faine on Melbourne ABC’s morning show, and it’s politics as usual.

One of her very first interviews is with a NSW gay and lesbian campaigner on how terrible it is that Abbott is against gay-marriage, and is Christian as well. Only in her last question, perhaps prompted by listeners’ texts, does O’Connor remind the campaigner that Kevin Rudd is also a Christian and also against gay marriage. This seems to startle the activist, who up to that point made Abbott seem in a troglodyte class of his own..

Tony Abbott then comes on the line and is greeted with O’Connor playing an entire Labor hit-ad at him before asking him to comment. When did the ABC start an interview with Rudd by playing a Liberal ad? O’Connor asks him if he’s been promoted above his competence.

O’Connor laughs along with a caller who rings up for an extended spray against the “sneak” Abbott that embraces everything from being a “failed priest” and having shifty eyes.

Later she has on veteran Howard-hater Mungo McCallum (who, for instance, has sneered that Howard was an “unflushable "). They agree that Abbott was a “thug” and a “hitman”. O’Connor notes that Paul Keating at least had “dignity” - a quality that will have escaped many. By this stage conservative listeners have had enough: the first on air tells the pair to give Abbott a fair go. He is cut off. The second informs McCallum his facts are wrong. No more calls are taken.

McCallum then goes on to praise Rudd for doing great things. His only criticism is that Rudd could have done more, and we must wait for his second term. O’Connor agrees Rudd is believing criticised by some of not giving us all he’d promised. More please!

O’Connor then has on two “spin doctors” who are meant to represent both sides of the political divide. Yet all agree on the need to “do something” on “climate change”. O’Connor suggests those against the emissions trading scheme tend to be those who simply don’t “want to engage”. All agree as well that Abbott is “divisive”. Turnbull wasn’t?

Again, the first caller to this segment complains about lack of balance, pointing out the program had, with the McCallum interview, sounded like a broadcast from “Trades Hall”. The third caller agrees with the first that Rudd seems insincere. The fifth doubts the global warming science and is cut off.

Does the ABC truly think this kind of political coverage - just one example of thousands we could produce over a year - is fair and balanced? Even its listeners now are complaining

[Wally]

Wow, that was a marathon read, made harder by my mind wandering off with thoughts of those heretics who lost their lives because they suggested the earth moved around the sun, that germs can cause infection, that animals evolve, that lead cannot be made into gold by alchemists, etc.

Seems to me that if you don't supp at the alter of the climate change deniers you must be a raving maniac with world domination in mind.

It's the politicians in concert with scientists who made the unpopular, but hard decisons to mandate lead free fuels, catalytic converters, and so on; they copped the hysteria from the media and self interest groups and out the back end we, the public benefitted, without handing power to some new world government.

[MO]

@wally, Are you for real,there are no climate change deniers here there are those that say climate change is happening all the time and its the reasons put forward to tax us even more that are in question. You cannot stop/change/alter whatever the climate does.
As for the rest of your post wake up.

[xtremerus]

Originally Posted by Wally

Wow, that was a marathon read, made harder by my mind wandering off with thoughts of those heretics who lost their lives because they suggested the earth moved around the sun, that germs can cause infection, that animals evolve, that lead cannot be made into gold by alchemists, etc.

Seems to me that if you don't supp at the alter of the climate change deniers you must be a raving maniac with world domination in mind.

Wally
Don't you realise that it is YOU that is going along with the mainstream populus GW theory at this present time. Just as people went along with the flat earth etc, that you mention above, in their time. It is YOU that cannot accept an alternative view, at this present time. YOU are the one in denial of alternative thinking, not us.

[XRQTR]

Originally Posted by Wally

It's the politicians in concert with scientists who made the unpopular, but hard decisons to mandate lead free fuels, catalytic converters, and so on; they copped the hysteria from the media and self interest groups and out the back end we, the public benefitted, without handing power to some new world government.

Ok seeing as KN answered most of my other concerns with your other posts, I think this is probably the first, or one of the first, big lies that started us down the GW track.

Think about this, if a post '86 vehicle is caught without a Catalytic converter on the car, which they must have due to the harmful exhaust fumes produced from the "Friendly fuel" and it's ability to reduce carbon emmisions the owner is liable for rather hefty fines, not sure but it's in the thousands from what I know.

Now tell me why all the pre '86 cars that now have no choice but to run this same "firendly fuel" have not been mandated to be retro fitted with catalytic converters and for the maintenance of said converters on the vehicle.

Riddle me that Batman.

Seriously though, the governments and their mates have perpetuated lies and myths since, well since just about forever, if they can somehow make a dollar.

Some time back Keilor cemetary stopped people from making borders around the grave sites of loved, citing OH&S, many other cemetaries did the same, it was not well taken by those who had to remove flower pots and other trinkets left around the graves as markers. They then told you that you could use only an approved site marker/border that could be bought from a particular supplier, only one supplier, guess what, he was a mate of the local councilor who pushed the legislation through.

Anyway my dad went and looked at this border and made his own, when they told him it had to be removed he asked why and they said it was not an approved design. He said well it's exactly the same as the ones your mate sells, the caretaker shut up and left it alone, my ded then went on to make a few more for others that wanted them, at no charge on labor.

Moral is we will get fleeced at every opportunity.

Another quick one for you, not CC or GW, got a phone call yesterday from a collections agency about my Citylink account, forgot to pay and it's now suspended. Anyway she says that a letter was sent out from the solicitors on the 30th of Nov, I was shocked and asked "if I haven't even recieved it then why are you calling me??" she then went on to tell me that I could avoid the $45 collection fee by paying over the phone with my card, I told her to get stuffed and hung up.

Got home, found the notice from Citylink and went in this morning to pay it at Lorimer St, they accepted payment.

p.s. with no late fees or any other fees for collections agencies.

Moral is if you don't ask you won't know.

The two morals are of course intertwined in that they are essentially the same thing, "If you don't know you will get fleeced" and even here where they tell you what's going on, it's the edited truth tht disturbs me most above all else.

No one here denies that we have an impact on our planet, we do however question the tactics they implement in order to make people comply.

Another question for you, if the treaty was so important to Copenhagen then why now are we being told that they (the Labor Government) aren't in any rush and can wait till February for parliament to resume. Why was KRudd threatening a double dissolution election and yet now they say "We could have used it , but we won't".

Why Wall??

I like people having an alternative view it's what makes us think and question even our own beliefs and actually aides us in finding new things when pushed to respond to new "truths".

[gtfpv]

Originally Posted by Wally

Wow, that was a marathon read, made harder by my mind wandering off with thoughts of those heretics who lost their lives because they suggested the earth moved around the sun, that germs can cause infection, that animals evolve, that lead cannot be made into gold by alchemists, etc.

Seems to me that if you don't supp at the alter of the climate change deniers you must be a raving maniac with world domination in mind.

It's the politicians in concert with scientists who made the unpopular, but hard decisons to mandate lead free fuels, catalytic converters, and so on; they copped the hysteria from the media and self interest groups and out the back end we, the public benefitted, without handing power to some new world government.

i dont get your angle , what's your point?

[Mr Brooksy]

Not jumping to Rudd or Tumbledriers deffence here, but I wouldn't go as far as saying they they have intentionally gone about trying to pull the wool over anyones eyes, any MORE or LESS than the media have.

Agreed that everyones claiming Armageddon in the political realm, not to mention media and big businesses that can cash in on the fears of climatechange (Toyota hybid rubbish drive anyone?), but I'm beginning to wonder about the other side of the coin too. The companies etc that say climate change is nonesence. It seems to me and other people I know that there are two camps, both with vested interests! While those of us in the general public try and sort fact from agenda.

One thing I have noticed recently too when talking about climate change is that ultimately we have not been keeping records on this planet long enough to say either "yes we are effecting the climate with our polution" or "no we are just in a part of the earths natural cycle".

What I do know is that, yes I can and need to stop buying non biodegradable products where possible, and take more responsibility for what I do to or for the planet. But preaching death and destruction (to borry from the theme of this thread) only puts people off, thinking that they are loonies and tree huggers. If there is an issue we won't know cause we have two sides telling us that the other is the devil himself!

Just my thoughts on the matter.

[olfella]

Originally Posted by Mr Brooksy

One thing I have noticed recently too when talking about climate change is that ultimately we have not been keeping records on this planet long enough to say either "yes we are effecting the climate with our polution" or "no we are just in a part of the earths natural cycle".

I think a lot of the scientist fuelling the fire in this whole issue should start talking to a few geologist's - because the whole history they need to back up their arguments is in the ground. And that shows that the earth goes through warm and cold periods, after all it is a living thing. So I agree with them in that this so called warming is cyclic as is drought and floods.

[Fev]

This will fail horribly and probably end up blowing up in their faces(or blowing up a whole country)

That money which will be channeled into third world countries will just end up lining the pockets of each and every official and dictator. The countries will stay the same, the poorer will get poorer and the richer will get richer - but they will also have more violence over control over the money which is coming into the country as well as bigger and better ways to carry out that violence. With the amount of extra money they will be receiving it wouldn't surprise me if someone got a hold of a nuke or two from the old soviet union...

[qwiksix]

I think Mr Brooksy makes sense in his comment about both camps having vested interests.

Personally, what I don't like is that the government is basically creating a tax on a very tenuous basis. It's no longer about how much you earn (income tax), or how much you spend (gst), it's about some possible link to a possible output (CO2) that possibly affects the atmosphere at an unspecified time in the future.

An interesting way to think about this is what would everyone think if instead of an ETS, they simply raised the income tax by, say 10%. Or jacked up GST to 15%. There's no real reason to have a new tax to cover an payment to other countries. We pay billions in aid already to other less fortunate countries, and not because of global warming.

So, will we get a refund if the levels go down?
(I think that's highly unlikely as I believe that the ridiculous levels they are talking about will not make any difference anyways. This means that they have an easy way to increase the tax in the future "Oh no! It's not enough, you need to pay us more money to save the world!". It's design to failed, but that's a topic for another day).

Overall, I think this sets a dangerous, illogical precedent for something that cannot be substantiated.

Can anyone mention anything that isn't taxed anymore? What will the next new tax after this be on?

ws

[divine_afg]

Walt Kowalski and KingNothing - You guys sound really passionate and informed about this Issue.

Got any Solutions ?

Easy to blame "our" Leaders Yet we don't even know who the Devil really is. ( I Frankly don't care and support any of them, I vote for whom ever has the right policies at the and if they change colors after well .....)

Why isn't any Scientist or Government in the world opposing this issue with such passion as you guys?

Why isn't this being debated and Citizens not asked for their opinions ?

............ Too many questions no Fair Dinkum answers.

[xy500]

Originally Posted by divine_afg

Why isn't any Scientist or Government in the world opposing this issue with such passion as you guys?

Why isn't this being debated and Citizens not asked for their opinions ?

if you actually took a look you would find there is quite a few...

[Walt Kowalski]

Please refrain from making jokes or smileys in this thread.

I repeat this thread is NOT about politics despite what you might think from a cursory glance

You are about to lose your democracy FOREVER

The Australian constuitution is about to be made redundant and people here are making smiley faces in their posts.

Think people

I would sooner work on my car and make jokes too but IT IS NOT A JOKE

If you are too lazy or too stupid to do proper research then at least read my signature and follow the links for a small inkling of what's actually happening to your beautiful country if our beloved Prime Minister signs in Copenhagen next week.

He is on the plane now to see Barrack Hussein Obama.

What do you think they are about to talk about?

Climatgate exploded in the US earlier this week.

The fraudulent science has been exposed

Only if we rise up and tell our local politicians that they are finished if they do this can we overcome

RING PARLIAMENT HOUSE today 02 6277 7111 AND ASK FOR YOUR LOCAL MEMBER

Tomorrow will be too late. The ETS bill will be done and dusted. Next stop Copenhagen.

Then it's goodnight Australia

[Hardtopxb]

Originally Posted by Walt Kowalski

Please refrain from making jokes or smileys in this thread.

I repeat this thread is NOT about politics despite what you might think from a cursory glance

You are about to lose your democracy FOREVER

The Australian constuitution is about to be made redundant and people here are making smiley faces in their posts.

Think people

I would sooner work on my car and make jokes too but IT IS NOT A JOKE

If you are too lazy or too stupid to do proper research then at least read my signature and follow the links for a small inkling of what's actually happening to your beautiful country if our beloved Prime Minister signs in Copenhagen next week.

He is on the plane now to see Barrack Hussein Obama.

What do you think they are about to talk about?

Climatgate exploded in the US earlier this week.

The fraudulent science has been exposed

Only if we rise up and tell our local politicians that they are finished if they do this can we overcome

RING PARLIAMENT HOUSE today 02 6277 7111 AND ASK FOR YOUR LOCAL MEMBER

Tomorrow will be too late. The ETS bill will be done and dusted. Next stop Copenhagen.

Then it's goodnight Australia

Blo0dy Hell!!! I actually had a thorough look at this treaty.. This is the first time I have actually understood what the Copanhagen Treaty stands for..A Communist Dictatorship(World Government).It will, if signed by our Government,Be able to, Override our constitution,Influence our economy,Dictate who we have to give vast amounts of our money to,What fuel we use,What cars we drive. The list goes on and on.I am going to contact my member of parliament(Labor) and get stuck into him..This has vast reaching(insedious) consequences to the future of all countries.. Get off your ***** and do something, Ie, contact your member of parliament...Blo0dy Hell...

[MO]

@Walt,I'm subscribed,Thanks to the MODs for allowing this to continue. Please everyone as Falcon Coupe said..'keep it mature and sensible'....
I have long wondered ,about 20+yrs, how this one world government was going to happen,it has been talked about for at least that long that I am aware of.
Never would I have imagined that they would use a green genie as the catalsyt. So for now I will watch with great interest what evolves here and on occaision will hopefully have some input.

[onfire]

You're correct calling Climate Change a religion. And what is religion you ask? A tool to keep power men, powerful.

However, the fact it.. most of us who are passionate about this topic, are really only passionate about one thing. Disguised behind disgust and skepticism, it's really about paying extra money. If the Goverment were to quietly factor in $7 billion a year into it's budget to give to the UN thanks to either a higher GST or tax rate, most of us would care less. And thats the truth.

The said vehicle in question, Climate Change is the killer. It's an ideology a majority of the average Joe population disagrees with. And thats where the problem lies. If a world wide initiative were to exist consisting of G20 or G8 funding to try to solve all the world's problems, and climate change being a much less significant issue on the agenda, it would be celebrated and praised for its effort.