Your thoughts on the new(er) falcons - Page 2

Dezza · 08-08-2006, 01:11 PM

I have driven a BA ute for work, and all I can say is that besides the massive blindspot (due to a canopy), it is awesome to drive. The power is sensational, it's very smooth and considering it runs leaf springs, it doesn't handle too bad either. I've also driven an AU Fairmont with tickford suspension, and it went very well too. If I had the money, I would have bought the car, I liked it that much. They both make the EA feel like an absolute slug. I'm surprised that you found the VT to have more torque, because the Ford 6s have owned the Commodore V6s for years. The AU had more power and torque from the VT, so maybe something wasn't right with that AU.

bradcad · 08-08-2006, 01:15 PM

That's probably my biggest gripe- the ford feeling like there's less torque

ever since the crossflows first came out I've known them to be all torque, and the holdens had to rev to keep up..

bradcad · 08-08-2006, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LSTerritoryGhia

VT Berlina - 18 inch steal wheels? They come with 15 inch alloys lol.

.

yeah 18" steel- she's on chrome rims....

and the motor didnt like revving past 3500 much till I changed to some decent oil and gave her a full service

SunDrifter · 08-08-2006, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bradcad

That's probably my biggest gripe- the ford feeling like there's less torque

ever since the crossflows first came out I've known them to be all torque, and the holdens had to rev to keep up..

That's still most assuredly the case. I'm honestly surprised you don't see that.

BF XR6 Torque 383NM @ 2500rpm
VZ Commode SV6 Torque 340NM @ 3200rpm (the 190kw alloytech engine)

I'm sure Steffo could come and quote you some older model's figures, but i only have the newer Wheels magazine handy at the moment.

bradcad · 08-08-2006, 01:28 PM

so I've got to be at least 5/10 by now don't I?

NA XR6 · 08-08-2006, 01:58 PM

Pretty simple bradcad if you like the Holden buy the Holden if you like the Ford buy the Ford

bradcad · 08-08-2006, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NA XR6

Pretty simple bradcad if you like the Holden buy the Holden if you like the Ford buy the Ford

Not the question- already bought the car. not buying another for a while- just guaging opinion

TheSneakiness · 08-08-2006, 02:10 PM

Just something I noticed from a drive I went on yesterday.

I have an AUII Falcon Ute. I went for a 35km drive in a VYII Crewman S.

The steering in the VY was friggin horrible. Far too heavy for my liking. Also, it takes some time for peak power to come into action (3500rpm), compared to mine (2000rpm onwards). It's also not as responsive on the throttle either.

All in all, I was NOT impressed with the VY. Jumped back in the AU and went home. Beautiful drive.

Laminge · 08-08-2006, 02:29 PM

Each to their own, dont shoot each other down.

The G6ET Spot · 08-08-2006, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bradcad

No bias here champ

I would have thought the Berlina (electric windows, 18" steel rims, climate, etc etc) would have weighed more than a ute (alloy wheels, small cab, alloy tray) but hey I didnt look uo the specs

I know of a wagon a mate says is the same- slow off the mark. I dont know quarter times or 0-100 times in comparison, but the falcons just felt slow

as far as bias is concerned the amount of near punchups I got into when I didnt know a throttle body from the spare tyre says I really wish I felt differently

You forgot one thing. Utes have a full chassis so will always be heavier.My ute weighs in at 1800kg kerb weight wouldn't be much difference with the I6 ute.I'm fairly sure that the VT is a lot lighter than that.As for comparing an AU forte with a VT Berlina, thats the same as comparing apples and oranges. If you are going to compare the VT with an AU,compare it against a Fairmont.Then you will have two cars with the same features and creature comforts,so you can have a real comparison.Go put your bum into a Fairmont and you'll be wanting to get rid of the VT straight away.

The G6ET Spot · 08-08-2006, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bradcad

yeah 18" steel- she's on chrome rims....

and the motor didnt like revving past 3500 much till I changed to some decent oil and gave her a full service

Hmmm, 18" steel you say. Do tell me what brand they are so I know not to buy them. Now I know why your car is so heavy,it's the wheels weighing it down.I think you will find that they are chromed alloy.

bradcad · 08-08-2006, 03:19 PM

ah 2 things I didnt know-

have the utes always been heavier than the sedans? I would have thought there would be considerable weight saving in only a half cab..

and chrome alloy hey?.. I spose I haven't seen any rusty mags lately maybe that's why. I heard they figured out how to chrome different metals a few years ago- didnt really know it was widespread. Cool!

Is it just steel and alloy they chrome, or is it virtually anything now?

**Professor Farnsworth** · 08-08-2006, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bradcad

Bugger all torque, handled like a boat, really plain plastic dash and just not appealing. All from a sub 100 000k car.

i'd suggest that it was thrashed in that case, because i've driven several AU's and they've never been short on torque, even ones approaching 200,000km. Yes i think the dash is horrible but other than that they're a great car, and pretty nimble, so maybe the suspension was shagged ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by bradcad

Same yard, all ****ed off and defeated, my wife spotted a VT Berlina 6. Midnight blue, standard, 118 000k's. She liked it, I resisted initially and thought may as well drive it.

Drove like a dream! floated like a cloud (not now she's lowered and on 18" wheels) nice stereo, beutiful interior, torquey, smooth and far more comfortable.

no offence, but that one made me laugh. Yes the interior is far better in my opinion, but as for 'drove like a dream', maybe you got a good one. Admittedly both the commodores i've driven have been VX (so you would imagine they'd be more refined) but both handled like buckets of crap.. One was an acclaim/executive or something and the other was an S pack. As i said, maybe it was a good one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bradcad

Even more recently- drove work's BA ute- all excited again, but plastic, understeer, gutless, similar story from my mates.

I've owned a BA & a BF and once again, not sure how you can say they're gutless ? I've driven several different BA's & BF's, XT's, Fairmonts, XR's, manual and auto, and not one of them met the desciption you just wrote. Interior and exterior plastic's fitting leaves something to be desired, and the dif's and transmissions in the BA's were notoriously clunky.. but that's not what you mentioned.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bradcad

So my question- How do you guys feel about the AU? In fact, how do you feel about Falcons in general since the EA? I'm just a bit dissappointed is all and almost wish we were in the day of the XD, and just wondered if I'm alone in this...

Dad had an XD Ghia, EA Ghia, now has a BA1 XT 5 speed, i've owned 2 EL Ghia's, one 4.0 one 5.0, a ba xr6 and a bf xr6, and not one of them has ever displayed any of the problems or 'issues' that you complain of. I've had driveline issues and a paint issue, other than that just fiddly little problems like interior trim.

So how do i feel about the AU and other falcons post EA ? Pretty good really, otherwise i wouldn't own my 4th Ford now.

Grechie · 08-08-2006, 03:46 PM

the au is sluggish off the line compared to the VT yes, fair enough, all auto fords r slugs becuase of there 80kmish first, but ull be surprised who passes the 400 metre mark (1/4 mile) ... ;) it will up n boogy pretty quick ...

bradcad · 08-08-2006, 03:57 PM

Its not really just the dash or just the road feel or just the power..

I mean every car is a trade in some way. But especially the ford I looked at just lost in almost every category. Thinking about it- Ihave driven an EL 6 months ago- over 200 000k's and not that well looked after and had a bit more instant poke than mine...

The BA- once again all I can say is I didnt wind it out, but nailing it and even holding it in gear for ages just didnt impress. I guess I've just been in a couple with problems...

I think I'd have gone for the AU over the VT if she had the torque ....I must admit I dont mind them dropped on the ground, big wheels and dark paint & tints....Just didnt do it for me on the day.

I think you lot are right- bit of bad luck on the day. When i'm looking to upgrade I'll look more closely at the Fairmont, and either forced induction or an extra couple of cylinders...I think I'll be happy then..

Cheers

**Professor Farnsworth** · 08-08-2006, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bradcad

When i'm looking to upgrade I'll look more closely at the Fairmont, and either forced induction or an extra couple of cylinders...I think I'll be happy then..

Cheers

when you're talking a couple of extra cyclinders, all the problems seem relatively insignificant

NC 5ltr · 08-08-2006, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bradcad

Gday

beutiful interior, torquey, smooth and far more comfortable. The only downside- the falcons brakes were stronger.

Even more recently- drove work's BA ute- all excited again, but plastic, understeer, gutless, similar story from my mates.

falcon 6 with no Torque...got to be joking...as for the coomodore 6 being smooth.....

**PepeLePew** · 08-08-2006, 04:23 PM

Just thought I'd throw this in....

Mr Hertz often throws XT's and XR6's at me when Im renting and I'm quite surprised how well the low km examples drive. Being renters, they turn to crap pretty quickly once the kms get up, buy other than that I learnt enough to want to buy one.

BUT....I've rented Avis a couple of times due kiddy seats are cheaper. And without a whiff of bias, I found the VY2 and VZ TOTALLY underwhelming.

Im glad Holden now have the VE.....it was needed. I just hope the engine boogies harder in it than it has previously....

Sorry I digress..

bradcad · 08-08-2006, 04:37 PM

Geez mate dont be sorry- that's the point.

I'm just kinda dissappointed now- i could have had my Ford by now if I had of looked harder...

desGT · 08-08-2006, 04:56 PM

I had a VS (sorry, but company car!) which was ok for a basic car in those days. Then the VT came out. Same engine, but much heavier body. What a performance dog c/w the VS. So next commodore had to be a VX "S", supercharged. The VT (6) was not a good performance car, having owned those series.

SunDrifter · 08-08-2006, 04:56 PM

Surely you didn't just go to one car lot and look at two cars?

The G6ET Spot · 08-08-2006, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SunDrifter

Surely you didn't just go to one car lot and look at two cars?

By the way the first post reads I thik he did.

:

bradcad · 08-08-2006, 05:04 PM

actually, no I didnt. I only looked at 3 falcons. Only drove 1 because I could tell from the idle the other 2 were buggered, both at ford dealerships of all places

not to mention the yards I went to ate too much time- I was working 60- 70 hours on my business so finding a car became a bit of a squeeze

GT290 · 08-08-2006, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bradcad

WTF are you talking about exactly?

I asked a legitamate question, wanted to see if others felt the same as I get a similar reaction in real life, and I'm a troll. Nice one

Go bugger yourself buddy

Point seems is that you have made your choice and are happy with it, why do you now find the need to ask evry body els. Should you not have decided to do that before your final chioce. Your father was it? you said has an XR8 what is that like, surely it in its self would answer your question that not evry car is sluggish and plain plastic dashed. just not sure what would be of help to you now the chioce has been made mate.

bradcad · 08-08-2006, 05:35 PM

Well, I'm happy with what I've got. But it's eaten at me a bit ever since really. I mean, Ford, Holden, no real big deal what you drive.

It's just it's kind of been one of the goals I've had since I was young to have the nice falcon. And when I got the chance like I said I was dissappointed.

I've had a couple of mates recently drive the BA falcons. They were excited because they had heard a bit about them and wanted to drive the 'newish ford', but they all literally said to me their buckets of ****. Keeping in mind they were comparing them to their Holdens.

So the point of posting this here was, once again (lets all read this bit) to guage opinion on the direction of the Falcon in recent years and get an idea whether there were others that felt the same, or whether I just happen to be around people who just dont like them. I still have a soft spot for the fords though.

It's as simple as that really.

Oh my old man just got his XR8 which is why I came here in the first place chasing info, also for his truck. The EB is ok but my mothers b/f bought one brand new when they came out, and had no-end of trouble. Broke down less than 5 k's from the showroom, back for defect more times than I can remember, the ABS module and maon ECU were replaced 5 and 3 times consecutively (mostly because they couldn't figure out why the brakes would lock out so you couldn't stop), the car was repainted because the front panels started to peel, several times wouldnt start, and this was all in the first year of the warranty period. Then, 1 year old, said to ford 'fine I'll wear it, how much trade for a new XR6'. I was there when the salesman told him $21 000. He paid $36 500 new eb 's' pack with some options. So I'm not too keen on the EB as such...was a nice car back then when she was going.

**Professor Farnsworth** · 08-08-2006, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bradcad

I've had a couple of mates recently drive the BA falcons. They were excited because they had heard a bit about them and wanted to drive the 'newish ford', but they all literally said to me their buckets of ****. Keeping in mind they were comparing them to their Holdens.

I'd say they're telling you that because of the long first gear.. I owned a BA xr6 and a BF xr6. The BA was a 4 speed auto and the BF was a 6 speed auto. The difference in the transmission made the two cars like chaulk and cheese. The BF would rocket off the line where the BA took a while to spool up, which made emergency situations interesting. You can mod the BA to be quick enough, but i suggest yourself and or your mates go and test drive a BF 6 speed auto and see the difference. Having said that it's relatively inexpensive to get an AU to fire off the line. All depends what you're after.

Deadman · 08-08-2006, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bradcad

So my question- How do you guys feel about the AU? In fact, how do you feel about Falcons in general since the EA? I'm just a bit dissappointed is all and almost wish we were in the day of the XD, and just wondered if I'm alone in this...

At the end of the day, if you felt you drove enough models to make your decision then that's all that matters. I still believe you should have test driven more vehicles, but that's just me.

I've been driving almost every different model Falcon since late series EL's, through the whole range of Tickfords, LWB models, FPV's etc, you name it, all the way through the the current BF range (and yes, Holdens & Mitsu's to compare as well - and for the record, the Magna's were overall a better package than the Commodore anyhow... Give me a late 90's Magna VR-X over a VT anyday...)

Did Ford move in the right direction with the recent Falcons? Hell yes. They've been (far) superior to any Holden offering since the BA launched, the AU (esspecially Tickford & XR series) has it's appeal as a pure drivers car and is becoming popular with it's value and performance now as a second hand car, and the E series is still awesome IMO. I can't wait to see what the Orion model brings to the fold.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bradcad

I've had a couple of mates recently drive the BA falcons. They were excited because they had heard a bit about them and wanted to drive the 'newish ford', but they all literally said to me their buckets of ****. Keeping in mind they were comparing them to their Holdens.

Then you can go and talk to a whole different bunch of people and get the opposite response. And that's all that is going to happen, round and round we go...

S3SR · 08-08-2006, 06:12 PM

bradcad.... honestly i think that gaywoo made you all funny

usually people like the VT then drive the AU and swear to never drive a holden ever again... like me.

as you and many others partly including myself believe that australian motoring peaked around the time of the xw/xy and went up and down to this day....
the au in my mind was fords way of trying to predict the way motoring was going (new styling hence headlights and shape of car) and did that fail... interior you'll find is plain and well little boring sometimes, but the interior WORKS 100% nothing is out of reach and nothing cant be done with only 1 finger (almost everything)

also with each change in model reliability and few other things like safety and fuel econ are improving, the AU was the car that had a bit of everything...

anyways not sure what you asked i didnt read it all but if you ask me id sell the AU for a 67-69 mustang or a XW/XY any day!!...maybe not an XD
BUT if you bought a newer model falcon (AU-BF) then dont pick out the negatives but improve the positives..if that makes sense

just remember anything is better than a gaewoo

EDIT: good luck and enjoy whatever you choose so long as it has a blue oval

bradcad · 09-08-2006, 04:49 AM

Ha! Gaewoo. That's gold.

As much as I hated that car it just kept going...

Stoney! · 09-08-2006, 07:02 AM

I'm sure it would come no surprise to a few of you here that I agree with Bradcad, after reading some of the things he has been saying, its refreshing some old thoughts.

I remember I had the VY and the boss still had the awful AU Wagon (to transport stuff between branches) Anyway i had to take it up to another branch to pick some stuff up and I also was quite grossed out with the power, now the VY wasn't the nicest car to drive, with heavy steering and a rickety ride, but it was at least faultless.

I noticed that if the AU hit second and then you wanted a bit of power it simply wasn't there. Apart from that was the god awful loud transmissions whines, clunking and flaring (all of which the VY had done but to no where near the extent, and no tranny noise)

Then there was the annoying offset driving position wich i hated, unspportive seats and strange seat height, not no mention the boring as bat **** dashboard.

I would prob own a BA over a VY, BA and VZ is a tricky one, but id own a VT over an AU any day, it was horrid!!!!

After the VY I was scared to get a BA after driving that AU but it was a much more pleasent car, far from perfect, but deffinatly better, then I found myself at home in a VZ SV6 Before I left the company, It was great, smooth as silk, good power, sure footed handling, average but not bad ride quality, very quiet, but **** throttle response from the Drive by Wire.

Overall I think the VZ is a great car and looking at a lot of car reviews point people in the same direction, sure some may say the BA is a better car (which opinions can differ between certain people) but no where does it ever say the VZ is a bad car.

I remember driving a VT once, and I thought it was nice, I hear a lot of brake issues but I recall it having really nice brakes, I might have to test drive a few more of them before i buy one and read up a bit more on the VT's

Stoney!