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#151 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Geelong
Posts: 2,374
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Funny because its true . An why people think opinion pieces are anything but opinions amazes me . An on a separate note i also find it funny that people that criticise andrew bolt for being right wing . Always think the Age and abc is unbiased . |
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#152 | |||
Starter Motor
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 27
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![]() ![]() ![]() The most sensible argument I've heard yet on 'climate change' But wait! To all you fearful people who are worried about being swallowed up in clouds of cO2, I have news which I feel bound to pass on to you. A few weeks ago during a heavy drinking session friendly aliens came to me & told me climate change is an evil alien plot to distract us while they plan to take over Earth. Go hide under your beds ecotards & let the sensible people deal with the issues. I'll tell you when it's safe to come out. ![]() |
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#153 | ||
Budget Racer
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 2,420
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So the message we take from this thread is to not worry about facts as much as bias?
What is fact will be dependent on your bias? There is no middle ground, just for us or against us? Nothing is grey, everything is black or white? You have to wonder why these threads never go anywhere, and are a complete waste of time. Come to think of it, I want my 10 minutes back.....
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12.1@112Mph 285rwkw on n2o Cleveland Power |
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#154 | ||
Regular Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Caboolture
Posts: 138
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I don't think I've sen a left wing chain email, but if I did I would treat it with the same scepticism. The point being chain emails are designed by organisations to try and create support for whatever agenda they are pushing. They are often misleading and make many unsupported claims. This type of PR campaign is called Astro Turfing and is illegal in the US, I'm not sure about here.
Newspaper stories go either way. I was only suggesting that no matter which stance they take, they are written with a bias for selling media not accuracy in reporting.
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#155 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 12,077
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#156 | |||
GT
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: SYDNEY
Posts: 9,205
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right wing people get thier noses out of joint at any mention of politics and blame the left wing for all the problems and shortfalls of humanity . be it natural or not . in fact they would happily see the left wing diminished in an evolutionary phase . the only problem then would be . how can the world work with everyone working behind a desk , uselessness would suddenly be realised and there would be no one left to blame . |
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#157 | |||
Regular Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Caboolture
Posts: 138
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As it stands the majority of international scientists working on climate change believe that we are contributing to it. This is true despite a diverse source of funding. I'm in no position to agree with their science, I don't understand enough of it. I do accept that science is very critically examined by wide range of other scientists who are only too willing to poke holes in procedure our conclusions. I don't buy into whole paranoia of all the governments funding research with some diabolical plan to do whatever. It makes as much sense as the Americans faking the moon landing.
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#158 | |||
GT
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: SYDNEY
Posts: 9,205
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#159 | |||
Regular Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Caboolture
Posts: 138
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#160 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Geelong
Posts: 2,374
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Oops this photo was taken in melbourne 2 days fter Mr bob brown blamed the floods on the coal miners . ![]() |
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#161 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 12,077
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Seriously? |
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#162 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 12,077
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For many years the smartest and most powerful scientists in the world KNEW that the world was flat. The evidence was obvious and overwhelming. Only an idiot would not understand this. People who disagreed were ridiculed and often jailed tortured or murdered because if all of a sudden people started to believe them then the smartest and most powerful scientists in the world were wrong.....and that can not happen. Matter cannot be created or destroyed.... It is impossible to go faster than sound...... Time is fixed not variable..... Facts are not facts, never have been never will be.....the more we learn the more we realise we have been so wrong so many times. The one thing that has proven itself to be true for millenia is the the best way to control people is to keep them afraid of something. It is important that this thing must be overwhelming and not disprovable. It the beginning it was "life after death", if you did not do what the "powerful" wanted you would burn in hell. This era, known as the dark ages retarded advancement by a thousand years. More recently we have had the nazis, the communists, Y2K, terrorists and the most recent "climate change". No one can prove either way so we are afraid. It is interesting to note that ALL of these problems have been solved the same way.....MONEY. Pay the church, go to heaven.... Pay taxes, defeat the bad guys.... Pay taxes, protect against Y2K.... Pay taxes, defeat the terrorists..... Pay taxes, fix climate change..... And those are FACTS........ |
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#163 | |||
Regular Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Caboolture
Posts: 138
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This is one of my favourite exercises on how perceptions distort the evidence you see. Just read the instructions then click on the link if you are interested in having a go at it. gorilla and basketball I also like the "count the F's exercise". A lot of you guys have probably done this one if you ever did process improvement or total quality management courses.
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#164 | |||
Regular Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Caboolture
Posts: 138
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#165 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 12,077
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#166 | |||
Regular Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Caboolture
Posts: 138
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As for government conspiracies; they can't even decide what side of the road we should drive on, yet alone agree on something so complicated as some sort of international master plan to subjugate the entire human race.
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#167 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 12,077
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The simple fact is regardless of whether there is or is not man made climate change the proposed solutions always involves taking money from people and giving it to governments. Solutions that involve spending money are never popular. e.g. Dangerous section of road. Plan A) fix road costing money Plan B) speed camera making money Which one of these happens most of the time....... Which one solves the problem..... |
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#168 | |||
335 - STILL THE BOSS ...
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Melb East
Posts: 11,421
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There's definitely climate change ..... over 150 years its been up and down like a (you know the rest) and will continue to do so. The cause? Ask 1000 scientists and you'll get close to that many different answers. Every time there seems to be an event of biblical proportions be it a flood, earthquake, or what ever ...... amazes me that they say "Worse one since 1932 ...... " ''Hottest day since 1972" "Third warmest night on record .... " So it was hot and cold back in the ol' days. ![]() Its guess work at best. No one can give to much credence to the notion that we are just so powerful, we can turn climates on and off at a flick of a switch ...... we are not that clever ..... and do not confuse environmental vandalism with all this crock thats being spouted by the highly paid.
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'73 Landau - 10.82 @ 131mph '11 FG GT335 - 12.43 @ 116mph '95 XG ute - 3 minutes, 21.14 @ 64mph 101,436 MEMBERS ......... 101,436 OPINIONS ..... What could possibly go wrong! Clevo Mafia [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] |
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#169 | |||
Regular Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Caboolture
Posts: 138
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In cases of hottest days, coldest days, or wettest days, these are simply products of media looking for a story. Scientists don't use these as evidence, they use trends based on an understanding of weather cycles. I find it a bit naive to think that we can modify and pollute to the level we have over recent decades without this having some effect on the world.
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#170 | ||||||
335 - STILL THE BOSS ...
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Melb East
Posts: 11,421
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'73 Landau - 10.82 @ 131mph '11 FG GT335 - 12.43 @ 116mph '95 XG ute - 3 minutes, 21.14 @ 64mph 101,436 MEMBERS ......... 101,436 OPINIONS ..... What could possibly go wrong! Clevo Mafia [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Last edited by Auslandau; 23-01-2011 at 12:54 AM. |
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#171 | ||
Starter Motor
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 27
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It's the politics beind this issue that beggar belief. Australia's emissions are a very tiny percentage of what China, India etc put out, so if we are all going to frizzle & burn up or drown from melting ice like some scientists want us to believe, what good is putting a tax on Australians going to do? China & India don't give a flying **** about any emissions so even if Australia didn't exist it would make virtually no difference to climate change & whatever scaremongering stories they sell us.
& this is the basis that some Australians would vote a government in - because they've acted on climate change. It all started with that ******** Rudd & carried on with his Bulldogs full foward Joolya, backed up by the biggest ****** ever to grace the halls of parliament, that weirdo Bog Brown. FACT: If climate change is real or not, what Australia does makes no difference. So why is it such a massive issue in politics at the moment? Is it because some incompetent ******* can't run a country & need to impose another tax on us to meet their budget? I'll leave you to draw your own conclusions but I for one am decidedly ****ed off about it. ![]() WAKE UP AUSTRALIA YOU'RE BEING SCREWED! ![]() |
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#172 | |||
Regular Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Perth
Posts: 267
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#173 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ivory Tower
Posts: 5,414
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Climate change has been occuring since the beginning of time, including atmospheric heating and cooling (think ice ages) long before we started burning fossil fuels. A carbon tax wouldn't have made a difference then and won't make a difference now.
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2021 BMW M550i in Black Sapphire Metallic.
11.52 @ 120mph stock |
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#174 | |||
Regular Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Caboolture
Posts: 138
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Quote:
The tax is just a way of dealing with the problem. No matter how the problem is attacked it will cost money. For a business to bring a product to the market with less emissions it will no doubt be more expensive. But all that is happening is that we are realising the true cost of the product. Theory is just theory, yes. We use theory to manage all sorts decisions. Solid theories do have a wide range of supportive evidence to back them, Darwin's theory of evolution, Newtons theory of relativity, ect. In the case of climate change the weight of evidence and scientific opinion is in favour those advocating human activity is having an impact on climate change. They are random facts. Temperature changes on a daily and seasonal basis. When you see a random fact like these in media stories they are only used as a hook to get you to read the story. They aren't part of climate change study. Media work in cycles. One week they will do pro climate change, the next week or month they might feel a negative climate change article will sell better. They just pick some isolated event to hang the premise of the story on. This should never be confused with proper scientific research. Oh, and just to clear this up. Climate change theory doesn't say we control the climate. All it says is that our activity has an effect on it. Research funding is largely grant based, which is a little better than paid employment based. In the end, this model of funding has historically worked very well with science being one of the most critically examined professional models. I still see a lot more evidence to support the majority of researchers views than to disagree with them. If It was government telling me this I would be highly sceptical. However until recently governments were not supporting it. The only reason they support it now is because they are worried that their economies will suffer greatly if they don't address the issue. Countries like China see things a little differently and they want to make that jump into an industrialised country and are willing to sacrifice a lot to do this. Their view is that we in the west used cheap dirty technology to make that jump, they feel they should be allowed to do this too. In the end it will be like any improvement and it will cost money, just like pollution control on cars cost us money, just like safe work practises cost us money, just like medicare cost us money. All these sorts of things cost money, and we just deal with it and don't get too caught up against it because in the end we do see the benefits.
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#175 | |||
Regular Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Caboolture
Posts: 138
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Quote:
As for politics. Poorer countries see this legislation as an economic weapon that the industrialised countries are using against them to keep them from developing and challenging the richer more industrialised nations. Despite the wide spread of acceptance of climate change, no one wants to be the first to move on it. Everyone wants someones hand to hold and make take steps together. Ever been with your mates discussing what you want to do that night, and everyone is saying "oh, I don't know, what do you want to do"? I've seen this go round in circles for ages. Sometimes it is just a matter of someone just say, "let's do this" and off everyone goes, decision made.
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#176 | ||||
Force Fed Fords
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Enroute
Posts: 4,050
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Don't like the facts? Change them. "The scientist that don't believe it are very few" - BS. The number of scientists not entrenched with funding and tenure who discredit the whole climate chang fiasco is exponentially growing. Here's a fact for you, the momentum of the climate change cult is diminishing, and desperate ecotards like Bob (and his mate Neil) Brown are resorting to desperate measures. Further, comments like Bob's about the coal miners only serves to enrage the public and do damage to the cause. Tell me this though Mr Science; if man is causing Global Warming/Climate Change/Climate Disruption, how is the planet Mars mirroring our temperature fluctuations? A couple of pages ago, I accused you of being a troll. I can't help but feel a sense of vindication. Have you commented on anything other than this topic? Want some Cool-aide for the other ****ologists?
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If brains were gasoline, you wouldn't have enough to power an ants go-cart a half a lap around a Cheerio - Ron Shirley Quote:
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#177 | ||
Regular Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Caboolture
Posts: 138
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You can rant and attack me personally as much as you like, that doesn't change the fact that climate change is more widely supported by those that have studied it. It is a personal choice you make to accept that or not. Or you can continue basing your belief on minor factoids that you cling to to help justify your stance.
As for contributions, they will come. This was just one thread I read early on that interested me, and I thought I could make some meaningful comment on. As for Ford specific content, I just don't have that knowledge, I've only had a Ford for a few days and it is the first that I've owned. When I have had a chance to read threads and make some contributions or ask questions I will. I have made comment in other threads, and I have introduced myself.
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#178 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,457
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We are the largest emmiter per capita in the world. We are also the most sparsely populated country on the plannet. That means goods are transported a long way. We also have a big livestock market that is exported all over the world. Livestock emmit methane which is three times worse than CO2 as a greenhouse gas. These are issues that simply cannot be over come. |
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#179 | |||
Regular Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Caboolture
Posts: 138
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Quote:
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#180 | ||
Size it up
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: big blue ball of mostly water
Posts: 591
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Is there any way to mesure the carbon footprint of this thread?
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