Online shopping v Local shopping

[silicon]

Originally Posted by buggerlugs

That article was spot on.........

Also http://www.thepunch.com.au/articles/...get-their-way/

PS the chinese translation is really worth doing - it sums up Gerry et al very well.

[Fled74]

Originally Posted by flappist

Hey you work for money and can be sacked on the spot if someone else will do it cheaper?

Just trying to lighten the mood a bit.

[fmc351]

Originally Posted by flappist

I see your point.

So should it be fair and equal across the board?

How do you think Ford Australia would go if we could buy a BMW or Merc for the same price as in Europe?
And of course no warranty which you don't need with Australian made cars do you?
No more Falcons anymore....

And should all employees be even?
No unions?
No penalty rates?
No job protection?
No awards?

Hey you work for money and can be sacked on the spot if someone else will do it cheaper?

One of the most obvious differences between Americans and Australians is that Americans see someone who is successful and applaud them, want to be like them and will work to achieve their goal whereas Australians attack them but would be like them if they did not actually have to do any work and just constantly complain that everything is not fair and someone ELSE should do something about it.

And we wonder why we are in such a nanny state mess..........

Except Gerrys the one whinging.

And the difference crap, is crap and you know it. No-one minded Gerry until he started on with his unAustralian crap and trying to protect his ability to gouge, and had the cheek to ask us to help him do it, to us.

I see you choose to ignore the cost benefit analysis to the Aussie taxpayer on collecting said GST on items < $1000.

Oh, and since when did standing up for yourself become synonymous with tall poppy syndrome. He wont share his 'teat' with you, no matter how much makeup you put on. Well, you never know.

[MAD]

Originally Posted by flappist

I see your point.

So should it be fair and equal across the board?

How do you think Ford Australia would go if we could buy a BMW or Merc for the same price as in Europe?
And of course no warranty which you don't need with Australian made cars do you?
No more Falcons anymore....

How much do you think Ford Aus could sell a Falcon for if they didn't have to honor warranty?

[cs123]

Originally Posted by MAD

How much do you think Ford Aus could sell a Falcon for if they didn't have to honor warranty?

You can still buy online from an Australian business and get a warranty.

The issue of warranties from overseas sellers isn't new either. I've bought stuff when I've been OS and realise that if it breaks I'll won't easily be able to claim.

[MAD]

Originally Posted by cs123

You can still buy online from an Australian business and get a warranty.

The issue of warranties from overseas sellers isn't new either. I've bought stuff when I've been OS and realise that if it breaks I'll won't easily be able to claim.

Which is my point of why we shouldnt be lumped with the GST on overseas purchases. If you purchase online in Australia, from a registered business, you will pay GST.

We need to remember this discussion started about a couple of retailers wanting the government to lower the duty free threshold from $1000 to something lower, or abolishing it all together.

If you're game enough to make an international purchase on something worth 12k or more and you know full well there is no warranty, then I reckon you deserve the discount.

[69XWGT]

It GST and duty threshold used to be $250.
They raised it to $1000 because of implementation costs.

Anything over $1000 and you have to pay GST and depending what it is you may also have to pay another %5 duty

[MAD]

I dont remember it being that low, the lowest I remember was $650 before it was raised to $1000.

The only reeason they are having a whinge now is because of the strength of the Aussie dollar. Shouldnt Gerry and Co be able to capitalise on the strong AUD also??

[MAD]

Seems someone has woken up to what was really going to happen from this...

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/business...-1225983250569

I dont see how 10% on a $600 item from overseas that is upward of $2k in Australia is going to change the outcome of it being purchased locally or not. 10% is not going to make it any fairer for them so how will it save tens of thousands of retail jobs??
I think they are just looking to set up a scapegoat early, so they can axe tons of jobs in the near future.

[MAD]

Or maybe he hasnt... I love the nature of news in our country now....
Get a story and run with it, dont check sources, just print it.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2...ction=business

Although the cinic in me is thinking Gerry is just trying to get more retailers behind the campaign so that the backlash from shoppers will be shared amongst them all rather than just a boycott of Harvey Norman and Myer.

[fmc351]

Originally Posted by MAD

Or maybe he hasnt... I love the nature of news in our country now....
Get a story and run with it, dont check sources, just print it.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2...ction=business

Although the cinic in me is thinking Gerry is just trying to get more retailers behind the campaign so that the backlash from shoppers will be shared amongst them all rather than just a boycott of Harvey Norman and Myer.

He will be feeling it out. He will be well aware of how this may impact not simply sales, but share prices too. At about Mar 2010 shares were at $3.90, and now at $2.90. They started to tumble around October.

Some of this may explain his motivation to be seen and heard. He seems to have judged his choice of platforms poorly. It has to be something along that line, he is no idiot. He would be able to do the simple maths that the additional taxes wont amount to huge differences in his ability to compete against OS online. Id say there is an underlying motivator, that has not been spoken.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by MAD

Or maybe he hasnt... I love the nature of news in our country now....
Get a story and run with it, dont check sources, just print it.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2...ction=business

Although the cinic in me is thinking Gerry is just trying to get more retailers behind the campaign so that the backlash from shoppers will be shared amongst them all rather than just a boycott of Harvey Norman and Myer.

So news articles are accurate when they suit your stance but not when they dont...???

[MAD]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

So news articles are accurate when they suit your stance but not when they dont...???

What stance?
These two articles were published online within about 40mins of each other.

I can only assume you think I was referring to the second article with my comment about checking sources, but in fact it was aimed at the previous.

[BENT_8]

I think its human nature to run with evidence that backs up ones personal ideals...no different to the constant positive and negative spin in the Housing thread, not that im going OT with that line.

My missus went to our local HN yesterday and said it resembled a vacant warehouse, not another customer insight, which , for a Thursday (Dole day) in centrlinkville (Elizabeth/Munno Para) is most unusual.

There is definately more to this story than meets the eye, i mean, why on earth would you risk putting lots of people offside on the back of a consumer confidence slump, not to mention bringing to light the option to purchase online to many who have never considered it.

Im going with mass job cuts too, as lets not forget it was Gerry who helped spruik the 'she'll be right mate' line when Ruddy was stimulating our pockets, so he needs a scapegoat now he's feeling the pinch.

[trippytaka]

Originally Posted by dave1

Can l ask a question? What are sites members recommend for purchasing online. Here is a few l have used.

GRATUITOUS SPAM

Personally I'd be using trippytaka for tees :P

[blueoval]

I find this youtube video quite amusing
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hg4w8QgY1v4

[Barnaby]

Originally Posted by silicon

Also http://www.thepunch.com.au/articles/...get-their-way/

PS the chinese translation is really worth doing - it sums up Gerry et al very well.

去他妈的你自己，你的伪君子

****a

[Barnaby]

Originally Posted by blueoval

I find this youtube video quite amusing
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hg4w8QgY1v4

"Any politicians silent on this issue?"
"Watch this space very closely."

Priceless...

[buggerlugs]

http://www.news.com.au/business/busi...-1225981373508
Gerry has waved the white flag............

[MAD]

Update to the two ealier linked articles...

http://www.smh.com.au/business/gerry...ml?from=smh_sb

Retail kingpin Gerry Harvey has admitted a campaign to force the government to act on GST on online purchases has placed him in a difficult position and "trying to extricate myself is quite difficult".

And he said he would step back from the campaign, reconfirming comments to BusinessDay yesterday but contradicting statements made to ABC Radio just hours earlier.

Mr Harvey has been under fire from consumers this week after he joined a group of retailers including Premier Investments chairman Solomon Lew and Myer boss Bernie Brookes to force the federal government's hand on GST for purchases from foreign websites. Today, he reiterated he would step back from the campaign.
Advertisement: Story continues below

Mr Harvey acknowledged the avalanche of criticism directed at him and said it had caused him to rethink whether he should comment publicly on the issue.

At the moment, no GST is charged on internet purchases from foreign websites, provided they are valued at less than $1000. The coalition of retailers wants the government to impose the tax on the website operators or scrap it on local sales.

Mr Harvey said the "vicious and hateful" attacks had become personal and were something he could "do without".

He said he would encourage smaller retailers to come forward and speak publicly about the impact of the GST loophole on products bought overseas.

He confirmed he would remain attached to the coalition of retailers that sparked a public furore when it on Tuesday launched full-page advertisements calling for a level playing field on tax.

'I am in a very, very, very difficult position and trying to extricate myself is quite difficult," Mr Harvey said this morning. "I am talking to the coalition and saying to them 'look, we need me not commenting and other people commenting.' Particularly if we can get some small retailers that are happy to commentate and if the media is happy to report on smaller retailers then that would be much better."

BusinessDay has been flooded with comments from the public all week, with thousands of people strongly opposed to the retailers' plan to force Australians to start paying GST on overseas products bought online.

Earlier, however, Mr Harvey told ABC Radio he would not back away from the campaign.

"That's not in my nature to run away - I'll stand up and fight," he said.

"If I think something is right I'll fight for it, always have. If it's wrong or I've been proved wrong I'll walk away and I'll apologise."

Contacted by BusinessDay shortly after the interview was broadcast, he reconfirmed he would take a less public role.

Meanwhile Mr Lew, the man who brought together the coalition of retailers, most of which are owned by Mr Lew or his family, remains largely silent on the GST issue.

The comments at the bottom are interesting. I can see why he doesnt want to be the face of the campaign, he has the most to lose as his face is linked to his store, whereas Solomon is not linked directly to any store.

I still dont get what they are actually aiming for.... 10% on top of the massive discounted online prices is not going to change the number people that buy online.

What is the real plot behind all this?

[blueoval]

Originally Posted by buggerlugs

http://www.news.com.au/business/busi...-1225981373508
Gerry has waved the white flag............

The damage is done Im afraid. He will feel it in the hip pocket even more so now.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by blueoval

The damage is done Im afraid. He will feel it in the hip pocket even more so now.

Actually there will not be any real damage.

The average person has the memory span of a goldfish and the loyalty of Judas Iscariot.

Two weeks from now it will all be forgotten and the next media beatup will set off another furore.

If we Australians actually DID remember all the nasty things done to us there would be no supermarket or white goods chains, the Australian motor vehicle industry would have been closed long ago, every polititian would be unemployed and most senior public servants would be hanging by their necks from trees.

Internet shopping is flavour of the week but next week it will be "internet ripoffs" and the week after that it will be "Major chain closes down with 5000 unemployed, how could the government let this happen".........

[geckoGT]

I had a perfect example of all this pop up this week.

I need a new control O2 sensor for the Mini and have done the research. BMW want $506 for a OEM part, Peugeot want $426 (yes they are the same part as the 207 has the same PSA 1.6L 4 Cyl as does the Citroen C4) and Bosch australia want $360 plus $62 for getting it in from Germany as they do not hold stock of that sensor in australia. So the cheapest I can get it for $462 by ordering it in through Australian businesses.

Online I can get the bosch part through US Auto Parts for $161 USD which is $161 AUD at the moment because of parity. Add about $60 for shipping and I pay $220, a saving of $200+.

No wonder online shopping is starting to hurt Aus retailers.

[ebxr8240]

It's not just the parity of our dollar..
The population of these other countries allow smaller margins through higher sales...
I bought Powerglide parts way cheaper,rose joint 4 link suspension for 1/2 price ...

[fmc351]

Originally Posted by trippytaka

[/SIZE]

Personally I'd be using trippytaka for tees :P

Tell me more about this trippytaka mr ...ohhhhh

[RSgerry]

he is bleating because all of a sudden, he doesnt fancy competition. it was okay for all of them to buy in items made in china and tll the local manufacturers to compete, but when the shoe is on the other foot, they squeal.

in geckoGTs example, a 10% GST on his O2 sensor would have made it a $242 item. still considerably cheaper than the $506 from BMW. the issue runs a lot deeper here than the GST. it is a red herring.

finally, coles / myer had online shops back in the early noughties. they abandonded them when the dot com crash occurred. harvey norman has no interest in setting up online. and dont give us the bullsh*t about looking out for the smaller businesses, gerry. these are the very same businesses that HN, coles myer and the like are happy to crush in the name of 'competition'. you mad your money out of competitoon, now compete.

[buggerlugs]

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/business...-1225983898948

[ebxr8240]

With dept / interest rates / elecricity / water / rates / insurance etc increasing.
People are not spending like they have been..
Infact Australia has saved or paid off credit card on average 10% in savings the last 12 months..
Plus looking for cheaper options...
When I last went into H.N store I couldn't get service due to people signing up for 2 years interest free terms... I only wanted to buy 2 LCD T.V's...

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

I think you are over dramatising the whole thing...

People have more money now, and more stuff such as cars, tv's, toys, electronics, luxury items, bigger houses, etc etc than ever before

Even when I was a kid people had one tv, one car per family if they were doing well, these days we have a car per family member, and we have even more 'stuff' than any generation before us, most have a flat sceen tv per room, wii, playstation, surround sound bluray systm, iphone or similar per person, ipod, ipad, computers etc etc.

We go out more and spend more on take away and alcohol than ever before.

I don't recall ever going out to dinner with my parents, we had one cheap car, one TV in the lounge, no video game consoles, no mobile phones, no dvd, I recall buying our first video player when I got part time job after school.

There were no luxuries that we expect to have and deem to be essentials these days, so I think things are not as bad as some here make it out.

People complain and think they are struggling if they cant affort the $300 running shoes, $400 designer sunnies, drive a new FPV, HSV BMW etc at 19 years of age and if they don't have an iphone 4 the day after its released.

Those that thinks online shopping will destroy Australian retail industry, obviously has not been to the local shopping centre in the last few weeks, with huge car parks packed with vehicles driven by people all spending money like there is no tomorrow on junk they do not really need

[geckoGT]

Originally Posted by XB GS 351 Coupe

I think you are over dramatising te whole thing...

People have more money now, and more stuff such as cars, tv's, toys, electronics, luxury items, bigger houses, etc etc than ever before

Even when I was a kid people had one tv, one car per family if they were doing well, these days we have a car per family member, and we have even more 'stuff' than any generation before us, most have a flat sceen tv per room, wii, playstation, surround sound bluray systm, iphone or similar per person, ipod, ipad, computers etc etc.

We go out more and spend more on take away and alcohol than ever before.

I don't recall ever going out to dinner with my parents, we had one cheap car, one TV in the lounge, no video game consoles, no mobile phones, no dvd, I recall buying the first vido player when i got part time job after school.

There were no luxuries that we expect to have and deem to be essentials these days, so i think things are not as bad as some here make it out.

People complain and think they are struggling if they cant affort the $300 running shoes, $400 designer sunnies, and if they don't have an iphone 4 the day after its released.

Those that thinks online shopping will destroy Australian retail industry, obviously has not been to the local shopping centre in the last few weeks, with huge car parks packed with vehicles all spending money like there is no tomorrow

Some very good points there but for one fact, when we were kids most families were single income or one was only part time supplemental income. Today the average family it is dual income and much closer to shared financial contribution between those incomes. Yes as a whole we are financially better off now than we were 30 years ago, but we are more "time poor" than ever.

I do not see that new found wealth as reason to give it to someone else in the volumes that we do when you compare buying through australian retailers (particularly the big ones) and shopping internationally, in some instances we are talking more than 100% more shopping locally.


I do agree however that the retailers are not doing badly (referring to the retail big boys), their stores still seem to be busy and they are still recording profits. Personally I think they could use a bit of a profit cut, which is why I always look at the smaller independents first before going to the big boys with my business.