Fords obligations

xr8gal · 22-08-2006, 01:10 AM

Hi! I hope this is in the right area. I would dearly love to know if anyone can advise me or direct me to an informative site with info on manufacturers obligations regarding cars with ongoing problems.

Im not anal about minor hiccups and cosmetic imperfections, iM talking about major engine problems.

Im extremely depressed as a result of my car being back in the workshop yet again albeit under warranty. As far as i am concerned, thats beside the point. I bought a new car to avoid having a vehicle in the workshop every cupla months, yet, that's what is happening with this car.

Are manufacturers able to be held accountable for failing to supply a reliable new car?

BTW, the car is a 2003 BA XR8 and has been serviced as required and driven respectfully. We owned everything we had before we bought this car and borrowed against equity in our house to buy it.

I live in a remote tiny country town with no public transport and DEPEND on a RELIABLE car to transport my 2 babies from A to B.

This latest episode of problems has floored me emotionally. I am SO majorly disappointed, i have NO confidence in my car whatsoever. I have NO desire to even go pick it up when it is ready.

Have any of you ever had troubles to this degree where you simply have no faith in the car and no longer wish to drive it? I have contacted Ford HQ and there is an ongoing case. I have also made contact with Consumer Affairs. Anyone been in a similar situation, and any suggestions?

Im MEGA mega depressed about this situation, i feel so helpless but i cant afford to give in. We are paying this car off and as far as im concerned, its a faulty product.

Sorry to ramble on LOL... im at my wits end!!!!

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robbo_23 · 22-08-2006, 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xr8gal

Im extremely depressed

No need to be emo, cheer up

The first thing u need to do is stop being depressed before you can think proper. Im 18 and I've never had the troubles you are talking bout but here is what i reckon. Im guessing you are a girl, and by that, mechanics probably dont pay you as much respect as you deserve and therefore its hard to get them to do what needs to be done.

There isnt much you can do about discriminating pricks, so my suggestion is to get a car savvy male friend to help you out and take it into the mechanics for you. That way you are more likely to get what needs to be fixed, fixed. That is, unless it is a dodgy mechanic, then i suggest looking for another one.

Just my opinion, hope it helps

jimt3te50 · 22-08-2006, 01:27 AM

I had a new engine go in my T3 every 45,000km (once a year) for oil consumption.....

As frustrating as the system is (and I despise recommending it as the course of action) stay on CRC's (Ford's "Customer Relationship Centre") back, in a BIG way.

Get the dealer onside- don't go crook at them- they don't make the cars, and if it's an ongoing engine PRODUCT problem, they can't fix it without replacing it which will go through CRC anyway- they are informed as these cases are logged.

It's the only thing that will help without resorting to media intervention etc- and no-one wants to go that path.......

Recapping-

Keep the dealer onside- don't get crook at THEM
Press the point with CRC- you CAN get crook at them, they will ultimately drive the result, unfortunately (and it's a frustrating process)

I am assuming the issue is major ie engine replacement. If washer bottle keeps getting empty, you'd be nuts to go spare- but clearly you know what you are talking about and have reasonable expectations- tell them what you want to see happen.

Hope this helps- I've been there, and I feel for you.....

xr8gal · 22-08-2006, 01:31 AM

Thanks Robbo, i know exactly what you are saying... the problem isnt really the gender thingy tho... my brother is a troubleshooter mechanic for another manufacturer and he has actually been able to tell me what the problems are without even seeing the car...

i have it serviced at the dealership from where i bought it and when ive taken the car in, its always had the same diagnosis as what my brother has suspected... i have NO qualms with the mechanics, they do a great job and always have the car running like a bewdy...

Then along pops up a different problem... at the moment, its in for a problem with cylinder 8..

I guess im feeling more depressed than i should becos hubby was on annual leave last week and we had to come home to have the car fixed..

iM basically stranded at home, if my babies get sick, i cant even get to a Dr...

i just really dont wanna have that car, its in the workshop every cupla months...

Thanks for ya reply tho... its a totally logical explanation... just sadly, not in this case!

xr8gal · 22-08-2006, 01:33 AM

I have NO qualms whatsoever with the dealer... they have bent over backwards to look after me.... i have made it clear to them and CRC that i am more than satisfied with the work and the great service they provide!!

It IS the product that is defective...

xr8gal · 22-08-2006, 01:39 AM

The ironic thing of it all is hubby is the 1 that is the DEVOUT Ford man.... i gave in cos i liked the look of the BA...

i absolutely LOVE the car but dont want mine.... geez, i bought a lawnmower and after a cupla things went wrong, they gave me new 1... all i want is a new car that i feel CONFIDENT in driving!!!

I dont see any unreasonableness there?!?!?!!!!

:

robbo_23 · 22-08-2006, 01:45 AM

haha, if ford give you a new car because this one keeps on giving you grief, you would have to be a mistress of negotiation. Good luck none the less haha. But I guess your situation is quite serious, since the fact is the safety of your kids is being put at risk by a dodgey vehicle.

Im sure you will find a solution to your problem... Another thing to do would just buy an old car and look after it so it will be able to pick up the ball if the BA drops it. My 89 EA falcon was given to me for free, so you can tell it was in quite a state. But after spending a good amount of my winter holidays fixing it, it turned out to be a very reliable vehicle. Ive driven it from my parents house on the coast to brisbane 3 times now (2 hours each way) with no problems what so ever, but thats because i took the time to look after it.

But you might be able to come up with a more economic solution I dunno. Good luck none the less.

jimt3te50 · 22-08-2006, 01:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xr8gal

The ironic thing of it all is hubby is the 1 that is the DEVOUT Ford man.... i gave in cos i liked the look of the BA...

i absolutely LOVE the car but dont want mine.... geez, i bought a lawnmower and after a cupla things went wrong, they gave me new 1... all i want is a new car that i feel CONFIDENT in driving!!!

I dont see any unreasonableness there?!?!?!!!!

:

If it were that simple. If that's what you want to see happen, I would prepare yourself to be disappointed.

If I didn't get a new car after 3 engines (yes THREE) with the process I went through (and it was a loooong one) then I would be less confident in telling you it's likely you'll get a new car.

So you need to shift your sights- if the engine is what's giving you problems (and specifically what problems could help us) then having it replaced could be your best compromise and is what you should be aiming for. Influence the decision by driving it hard with CRC, it is the only course of action that will yield results.

robbo_23 · 22-08-2006, 01:48 AM

Jim has a good point about setting your sites on something thats achieveable then going for it.

xr8gal · 22-08-2006, 01:58 AM

Yeah, im thinkin that im gonna hafta get a rebuild...

my case manager has been away for a few days so that hasnt helped...

im expecting a call tomorra morning...

(can always hope for new car tho.... i got new lawnmower to keep me happy!!!)

xr8gal · 22-08-2006, 02:02 AM

i dropped the car off last tues am... today, i was informed that it hasnt even been started on yet cos they are waiting for Ford to authorise the go ahead on the cyclinder... my bro warned me that i could be without the car until after next w/end...

anyway, i appreciate the support here cos ive been extremely depressed and its not really a topic that is understood in the chatroom where i frequent to discuss pregnancy and kids !!!! LOL

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xr8gal · 22-08-2006, 02:08 AM

actually, in all seriousness, compared to some probs im reading about in the forums, my arent THAT bad..

its more the fact that i guess i just expected a car that didnt hafta go into a workshop every cupla months...

i mighta been better off buying a used car instead...

we DO have a 2nd car but hubby takes it to work and it has no child restraints in it anyway..

robbo_23 · 22-08-2006, 02:13 AM

haha, yer thats usually the case, its not as bad as u reckon

xr8gal · 22-08-2006, 02:17 AM

will prolly just upgrade to a series 2 or the bf.... i would need to research the problems in them before i starting throwing cash about tho... i dread giving more money to ford but man, i love the look of the car.... prolly just need a later model than this early 1 we have..

Outbackjack · 22-08-2006, 02:42 AM

Hi there XR8GAL. Has your dealer offered you a courtesy car while your XR is being worked on? At least you would be mobile again. If you are thinking of a BF, after driving mine now since December last year, I gotta say that they are a blardy nice car. So far not even a rattle. I hope your car problems are resolved soon. Cheers.

xr8gal · 22-08-2006, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Outbackjack

Hi there XR8GAL. Has your dealer offered you a courtesy car while your XR is being worked on? At least you would be mobile again. If you are thinking of a BF, after driving mine now since December last year, I gotta say that they are a blardy nice car. So far not even a rattle. I hope your car problems are resolved soon. Cheers.

Hi! Yeah i was given a courtesy car on the spot. My dealer is fabulous. The problem is when i left the car, we we expected to have it back by last Fri, so i didnt take out the kiddies restraints.

Once the guy from CRC gets back to me this am, iM gonna request that the dealership gets the seats from my car and bring them out here to the car i have. They will then hafta take this car over to the fitting restraint station at anutha town and sort that out for me.

The car they have given me is an AU Forte.... ummmm a BIT different to a BA... but im grateful none-the-less..

_

xr8gal · 22-08-2006, 09:54 AM

As for the BF, i havent heard too many bad things about them IF any.

I just strongly believe that as i paid for a brand new car expecting it to last for at least 5-10 years, i should NOT hafta now pay an odd 20K to get into a similar car that has been presenting problems since day 1.

I certainly wouldnt mind paying if i was upgrading to a GT/-P but to only upgrade to the newer version of the XR8 and yet pay out rather big dollars... thats what i really object to on principle.

The other thing too.... IF i AM going to hafta pay money out to have a car that i can rely on, i really dont think i would spend dollars on a NEW Ford car again....

My mood may change after ive spoken to CRC this am, anyway... a lot will depend on what they can offer as form of resolution...

Cheers

**Polyal** · 22-08-2006, 10:00 AM

XR8gal.

By the sounds of it you have stayed pretty level headed which is good, and dont be happy with the fact that your car isn't "that" bad; should never happen in the first place.

But obviously there is a percentage that are poo from the start, and the fact that its been back to the workshop numerous times would be so frustrating to say the least.

They gave you a forte! talk about cost cutting! Whats your dealers name? Seems like a good place.

Perhaps you could negoitiate a very good price on a trade in for a BF, while they wont like it, atleast they are retaining a customer.You could alway buy somewhere else remember.

Niceness goes out the window with business IMO (obviously dont go crazy), its costs you time and money for something that should of never happened.

Ford_To_Holden · 22-08-2006, 10:02 AM

Should have bought a Camry.

The lemon law it's time we had one.

xr8gal · 22-08-2006, 10:10 AM

Polyal...

this dealer is a relatively small country town dealer... at the mo, they have a series 2 BA which is a demo model... it has 3000kms on it ans is going for about 46-47K...

iM sure once i DO decide what i wanna do, IF i DID decide to gedda newie, they would be able to order 1 in...

it just HURTS me BAD to hafta pay out money just so that i can drive with confidence..

i will know more today anyway!!! CRC have been fairly good so far, i cant really complain too much there, YET.... :nutsycuck

xr8gal · 22-08-2006, 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

XR8gal.

Niceness goes out the window with business IMO (obviously dont go crazy), its costs you time and money for something that should of never happened.

LOL just saw that bit...

operate on ASSERTIVENESS without AGRRESSION!!!!

and i NEVER give up until i exhaust ALL avenues...

out:

anyway, brekky time for these bubs...

i wish i had just popped in here earlier on in the peace, i might not have to the stage of depression i have!

PS i used to post under the name of XR8QUEEN but i couldnt retrieve my password for some reason...

the majority of my posts were in the BA what probs have you had thread...

anyway... gotta feed the masses... thanks for the support, its much appreciated!

BAFalconXT · 22-08-2006, 10:22 AM

Really, the car is not fullfilling the purpose you bought it for. Ford are not honouring their warranty by not fixing the problem. And the product must have been below manufacturing standards when it was bought. All reasons you should be able to return it and get a refund... but no one enforces this. You can go to the state ombudsman, although they have no power, Ford will listen. Ford has had to fix afew things on my car, none were fixed the first time around.

xr8gal · 22-08-2006, 01:44 PM

I have no doubt that it will all be fixed under warranty without a problem, but then, how long do i drive the car before another problem arises?

It seems to be every cupla months...

I have lodged an inquiry with Consumer Affairs, havent lodged a complaint as yet, i need to see exactly WHAT my rights are as a consumer first...

Consumer Affairs take 2 days to respond so i should have heard back from them by tomorrow.

As for CRC, i was informed that i would receive a call this am, as yet, nothing...

CRC have been as good as they can so far... but empathy and understanding and repairs just dont do it for me at the moment...

I need to know my rights and then i will act accordingly and take it as far as i can.

:

Redrum · 22-08-2006, 02:05 PM

I sympathise with you. I have been in the same situtation. My solution came by getting rid of the car. I think there should be a level of practice, that is if a car keeps returning to a dealer with mulitple warranty issues, the maker should have to supply you with a new vehicle.

Smoke Pursuit · 22-08-2006, 02:13 PM

Ford wont replace the car regardless of how much you cry, for the sheer fact its nearly out of warranty anyways and its too late.

The things you need to do.

1. Ring Ford CRC - try and get to a bloke by the name of Frank, he is VERY decent to deal with. Talk to him about your problems, the issues its causing you with transport etc and ask that he tell the dealer to supply you with a Demonstrator free of charge, even if its a standard Falcon im sure they can accomodate you in some way.

2. Diary note all your discussions with CRC and the Dealer, keep dates / times and what was discussed noted.

3. Ask for the dealer to provide you with a complete list on everything thats been carried out on the car from day one.

4. Talk to the salesmen who sold you the car (thats if it was the selling dealer whos trying to fix it). If the salesmen is decent they and their sales manager may step in on your side.

5. Don't threaten Ford With consumer affairs crap or the media, the more you get them off side the less reactive they will be when it comes to fixing your car. They have more power then you sadly, it sucks i know but thats how it is.

Finally i suggest you talk to them about a brand new motor, depending on whats gone wrong and whats happening the best way to resolve the problem I think would be to drop a new engine into the car and see how that goes. I would also hit CRC up for some form of compensation, whether it be some free accessories or servicing to try and sweeten your faith again.

This is only a guide but you really do need to step on it with CRC and keep ringing them if you wanna get to the bottom of it, as for replacing the car sadly your in a dream with that, they have every right under the standards set in Australia to rectify the problem without replacing the car. As long as they make an effort to fix the vehicle you have no rights with consumer affairs, ive been there done that.

If your going to buy a new car you can buy brand new BA MARK II XR8s for $42,000 drive away, so I wouldnt be paying anymore then 40 k for a demo with 3,000!

CATFORD · 22-08-2006, 02:36 PM

Ummm what a drama......unfortunately these are mass produced cars....and probable cost Ford around $8000-12000 (parts supplied from the cheapest supplier and built by the cheapest labour....not a good mix is it) to make each car....and unfortunately some lemons get through the cracks....it looks like you have got one.....best thing to do is as soon as you get it back trade it....trade it fast.....and maybe try again...but if your so disheartened try another brand.....but they are all the same....there all massive company's and they can cover the odd disgruntled customer!!!

I feel sorry for you....I couldnt imagine how frustrating this process is!!!

NO NEED FOR THIS :togo:

xr8gal · 22-08-2006, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redrum

I sympathise with you. I have been in the same situtation. My solution came by getting rid of the car. I think there should be a level of practice, that is if a car keeps returning to a dealer with mulitple warranty issues, the maker should have to supply you with a new vehicle.

Yeah Redrum, thats exactly my sentiments...

Smoke Pursuit · 22-08-2006, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xr8gal

Yeah Redrum, thats exactly my sentiments...

You shouldnt have to get a new car to resolve the issues, a simple replacement of the motor should fix the issues if they have all been engine related.

If you could do us a favour, please list the issues you have had so perhaps some of us can give you a little more guidance on the best way of getting them fixed,

Cheers!

xr8gal · 22-08-2006, 03:44 PM

LSTerritoryGhia....

fantastic advice, thanks...

i havent lodged a complaint with consumer affairs yet... that aspect of the neg reaction was in the back of my mind...

i eventually rang CRC to speak to my case manager in regards to getting a demo model from my dealer... apparently, FORD can "hire" the vehicle for me.... but it needs to authorised and dealt with by CRC and the Dealer Principle...

im waiting for the salesman to contact me, apparently HE is the 1 i need to reuqest a replacement vehicle and they then proceed with the claim...

just peeves me immensely and i know im not the only person who has been in this situation... there really should be consumer rights for these instances...

its affecting me majorly and i shouldnt let it... its having an impact on everything i do... i just cant function properly due to being SO depressed and feeling gutted about the whole hopeless situation..

someone else also told me that 46-47K was way too much for that demo car too... i appreciate that input as well, thanks!!!

Smoke Pursuit · 22-08-2006, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xr8gal

LSTerritoryGhia....

fantastic advice, thanks...

i havent lodged a complaint with consumer affairs yet... that aspect of the neg reaction was in the back of my mind...

i eventually rang CRC to speak to my case manager in regards to getting a demo model from my dealer... apparently, FORD can "hire" the vehicle for me.... but it needs to authorised and dealt with by CRC and the Dealer Principle...

im waiting for the salesman to contact me, apparently HE is the 1 i need to reuqest a replacement vehicle and they then proceed with the claim...

just peeves me immensely and i know im not the only person who has been in this situation... there really should be consumer rights for these instances...

its affecting me majorly and i shouldnt let it... its having an impact on everything i do... i just cant function properly due to being SO depressed and feeling gutted about the whole hopeless situation..

someone else also told me that 46-47K was way too much for that demo car too... i appreciate that input as well, thanks!!!

No worries,

I seriously hope Ford comes to the party in atleast resolving your cars issues and giving you a loan car, thats the least they can do after what they have put you through.

Are you located in QLD by any chance?

Regards.