Do you think the new Toyota Kluger will dent Territory sales?

[AWD Chaser]

The new Toyota Kluger is here, and is it basically (from what I can see, Toyota's answer to the Territory)

With features such as:

Optional Rear Reversing Camera
Airbags (including Front driver knee, full length side curtain sheild - for all 3 rows (3rd row optional)
Optional 3rd row seating
RWD or AWD options
All your typical driver assist and accident prevention technologies
Optional electronic closing tailgate
Up to 3 Zone climate control on upper models
172Kw V6 engine
Entry price of under $40,000

If you get the 3rd row seats, you can even remove the 2nd row middle seat to walk (squeeze) through to the 3rd row....

Now that I have typed all this, it seems more aimed at the Lexus market... but the're the same company...

[sfr rob]

no photos to see?

[apolloxbgt]

Originally Posted by au3 chaser

The new Toyota Kluger is here, and is it basically (from what I can see, Toyota's answer to the Territory)

While toyota aus will be happy to have,I doubt the terri had too much to do with the desighn of the Kluger.It is a global car,it's aimed at ALL crossover wagon thingys in every market.

[Fordmuscle1965]

I'll think you'll find the 2wD version is actually shi#*y FWD :

[perrys]

I think the info in this thread is misleading.
-The new kluger is not here YET
-Rear reversing camera is STANDARD
-200kw 3.5 V6
-AWD or FWD

[perrys]

Originally Posted by Fordmuscle1965

I'll think you'll find the 2wD version is actually shi#*y FWD :

RWD is actually quite awful in snow where FWD is quite capable. As a truck, FWD with all the electronics is in fact pretty good.

[ThoR_]

I dont rekon. All though my parents just bought a Mazda Tribute. We used my mates GTECH timer 0-100 7.9 seconds stock. Would flog a Ford and it uses 11-12L per 100kms.

I dont think the Kluger will do much. I think it will be another one of those cars that sell but not much. Sorta in the corner of the store

[AWD Chaser]

Originally Posted by perrys

I think the info in this thread is misleading.
-The new kluger is not here YET
-Rear reversing camera is STANDARD
-200kw 3.5 V6
-AWD or FWD

200kw is not the figure for the engine in the kluger. The engine is capable of it, but the American version (Highlander) puts out 172kw...

[QualityCounts]

Originally Posted by au3 chaser

200kw is not the figure for the engine in the kluger. The engine is capable of it, but the American version (Highlander) puts out 172kw...

The current Highlander has 172kW, the same as the old RX330 and current Kluger.
The new Highlander has 200kW, the same as the RX350 and new Kluger on ULP.
Reversing camera will be standard.

[Raptor]

Hmmm, lets see

V6 engine sideways in the engine bay

Default FWD

Toyota fugly

Built for the US market so shitty dynamics and floaty ride

Nuh, I don't think it would make my short list

[mik]

Originally Posted by QualityCounts

The current Highlander has 172kW, the same as the old RX330 and current Kluger.
The new Highlander has 200kW, the same as the RX350 and new Kluger on ULP.
Reversing camera will be standard.

how much torque do they make?

[Dezza]

Originally Posted by Raptor

Hmmm, lets see

V6 engine sideways in the engine bay

Default FWD

Toyota fugly

Built for the US market so shitty dynamics and floaty ride

Nuh, I don't think it would make my short list

Agreed on all those points, but it won't stop people from buying them. Most people aren't car enthusiasts like us and just want a reliable car to get from A to B. That's why Camrys sell so well. They are incredibly dull, and have FWD but they still continue to sell. I could think of at least half a dozen mid to large sized sedans that I would choose over a Camry, but many people seem to just be happy with them. The Kluger will be the same. It is ugly and my guess is it would have a typical Toyota-spec uninspiring ride, so there's no way I would ever consider owning one, but many people will. I hate Camrys, and I reckon I'll hate these just as much.

[Fordmuscle1965]

Originally Posted by perrys

RWD is actually quite awful in snow where FWD is quite capable. As a truck, FWD with all the electronics is in fact pretty good.

I guess in a country like sweden it may be a good car but here in OZ snow is pretty thin on the ground so good luck and I hope you buy one soon so you can impress all your mates with the FWD tech talk. Me, Im a RWD man always have been, always will be as nothing I've ever driven FWD has given me any pleasure. :

[new2ford]

There is a 'vigorous' discussion of this on the Territory forum (http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=106229).
Some reviewers who have trialled it in the US have already noted that it's not up to Territory's handling standard, which has more than a little to do with primary safety (http://www.drive.com.au/Editorial/Ar...ID=41270&vf=12).
It has a lower towing capacity than the Territory.
It has 4/6 seats compared to Territory's 5/7 (http://www.toyota.com/vehicles/minis...er/index.html: click on the "Interior Innovation" page)
It's designed for California boulevards, not Australia (http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/s...010760,00.html) - the US is where its market is, Australia is just a pimple on that.
It's a Camry on stilts and will appeal to the local market sector that buys Camrys.

Edit

Originally Posted by perrys

RWD is actually quite awful in snow where FWD is quite capable. As a truck, FWD with all the electronics is in fact pretty good.

We've heard this on this forum before. Its a bit of a furphy, depends how well the car is designed. On the whole FWD works better on smaller cars, RWD better on larger car. Its just as easy to lose, or get bogged a FWD as a RWD. Do you imagine for a moment that Europe's huge fleet of BMWs, Mercs and Volvos is grounded every winter?

[Venomous1]

No way that thing sucks badly.

[perrys]

Originally Posted by new2ford

We've heard this on this forum before. Its a bit of a furphy, depends how well the car is designed. On the whole FWD works better on smaller cars, RWD better on larger car. Its just as easy to lose, or get bogged a FWD as a RWD. Do you imagine for a moment that Europe's huge fleet of BMWs, Mercs and Volvos is grounded every winter?

BMW sells 328xi, 335xi, 530xi in the states; Lexus sells IS250 AWD, GS350 AWD; Merc sells C350 4matic, S550 4matic. Give me a reason why? They are all normally RWD.

Whats Volvo doing there anyways? they are FWD/AWD like Audis.

[Bucket]

Humm...i'd have a hard time differentiating the "ALL NEW" Kluger from the previous model to be honest... This goes with the new corrolla too...in the hatch especially..The hottest corolla ever smacks of boring....ZOMG! It's teh all nu Fridge!

[Falcon Freak]

The vote options are crap. The Kluger will make an impact to Territory sales but I DON'T think it is sweet. The new Kluger is average looking but because it is a Toyota it will sell well.

FF

[schnoods]

Its called a Kluger.

Could be in the same category as Rio, Terracan, Tuscon, Trajet, Tiida, Sunny, Carnival, Fiesta, Satria, Waja, anything with shades and models named by 3 numbers ie 306, 929, etc.


Really, it sounds like the middle name that you dont end up disclosing.

They look like the name too. Not ugly, but enough to say no thanks.

[Dave_au]

Originally Posted by Venomous™

No way that thing sucks badly.

Get with the times - Thats the old model!

This is the new model:

[new2ford]

Originally Posted by perrys

BMW sells 328xi, 335xi, 530xi in the states; Lexus sells IS250 AWD, GS350 AWD; Merc sells C350 4matic, S550 4matic. Give me a reason why? They are all normally RWD.

Whats Volvo doing there anyways? they are FWD/AWD like Audis.

I am going back over time with Volvo. I don't know the reasons for BMW's marketing in the states. Perhaps US RWDs were so badly designed that people had trouble with them in the snow/ice so everybody's sold on FWD and the sellers have to go with the market flow? Worst winter weather in Europe is as bad as winter weather in US and the same drivetrain-induced marketing panic hasn't happened there.

I've been involved with FWDs since the 1960s, not exactly short of knowledge on this. (I find the whole debate ironic now considering how the compact BMC FWDs beat the pants off the crude RWDs at that time.) FWD has been widely adopted for manufacturing cost reasons not inherent handling superiority. A well designed RWD will handle better than a poorly set up FWD. A few months ago I was following a (FWD) Barina around a bend in pouring rain in my RWD Territory. The Barina went into a slide in front of me, the Territory held even with emergency braking to avoid the Barina. Sure tyres might have something to do with that but it does indicate that the debate isn't as clear cut as some seem to think.

Not saying your entirely wrong, its just not quite that simple. After some 35 years in many cars my instincts feel better in a RWD Territory than a FWD Kluger. The Wheels WASP tests put the RWD Territory ahead of the AWD Kluger in safe handling. If that is the case I can't see a FWD-only Kluger being better.

[UNR8D]

thank god someone is with the times, thats the pic of the old kluger since before the teritory was ever launched.

facts are

FWD and AWD

207KW

5 speed auto - 6speed not compatable with AWD, FWD may and i mean MAY get the 6speed from aurion.

up to 9 airbags inc drivers knee airbag

rear camera standard all models.

[Whitey-AMG]

Well , the new KLUGER doesn't look much better than the Old Kluger.

In typical TOYOTA advertising the new KLUGER will be pumping out @ 200 KW but probably won't have enough torque to pull the skin off a RICE pudding in the more useable bottom end range......aka AURION.

The whole philosophy of the TERRITORY is that it could easily be a sedan like car, stationwagon or soft roader all in one with the driveability as the main feature. Enough TORQUE to get it going easily and lug around 7 people if required.

KLUGER looks like the Love child of a LANDCRUISER and RAV 4.

If FORD go ahead and release the Terri Diesel, I honestly don't think the KLUGER will threaten the Terri..........In fact it may take sales away from prospective Landcruiser buyers ????

[Tles]

Originally Posted by Falcon Freak

The vote options are crap. The Kluger will make an impact to Territory sales but I DON'T think it is sweet. The new Kluger is average looking but because it is a Toyota it will sell well.

FF

Second that.

New Corolla is a @133% Yaris and both are loved - by women who buy or determine what get's bought - and by metrosexuals who think by acting and dressing cool like a women wants they might metsex.

KlugerII/Highlander - "the Camry of AWDs" is basically a big @133% RAV4 (women adore RAVs) so yes it will sell it's fat RSorf, just like Aurion does - it will hurt Territory too because it is now a viable option new and proven used so fleets and families will love 'em.
Toyota will undoubtedly use Prado and Landcruiser to promote there 4wd experience and Aussieness.

[mowog]

Originally Posted by perrys

RWD is actually quite awful in snow where FWD is quite capable. As a truck, FWD with all the electronics is in fact pretty good.

This is myth that was started by the yanks to get people to buy the POS front drive cars they were building.

[Dave_au]

Originally Posted by mowog

This is myth that was started by the yanks to get people to buy the POS front drive cars they were building.

Got proof?

[irlewy86]

Toyota never ceases to amaze me with their fine ability to match a name to a car
Kluger - (sounds like something you leave in a toilet bowl after a big night drinking)
Yaris - (sounds like an ugly girl you would see every now and then but would never dream of telling your mates about)
Prius - (Wasn't that the name of the ancient Greek god of Boredom)

[mowog]

Originally Posted by Dave_au

Got proof?

What proof do you need other than the facts. US car makers went FWD because it was cheaper to build a car this way. The problem was how do we sell this to the public? So they come up with FWD is safer. And people like yourself still believe this to be true. None of the true performance car makers produced a FWD car. Why? If FWD is so safe...

[niko]

ugly.

Originally Posted by Dave_au

Get with the times - Thats the old model!

This is the new model:

[jdg]

None of the true performance car makers produced a FWD car.

I dunno what you call a Civic Type R or Integra type R...

Although yes, most proper "sports" cars tend to be AWD/RWD.

But who buys a kluger...or any suv for that matter for its ride / handling / performance capabilities. For someone who wants a well built, safe, reliable big car i reckon it will be great...and I think it will have some impact on Terry sales.