End Import Parity Pricing For LPG

[Franco Cozzo]

Whats the difference between CNG and LPG besides one being liquid?

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

Whats the difference between CNG and LPG besides one being liquid?

LPG has a lot more energy per litre......94 MJ/m3 versus 38 MJ/m3 which means you need about 2.5 times as much CNG.
LNG is much harder to do for transport because you need a cryogenic tank, very expensive.

[jpd80]

Comparing current prices i've seen in Brisbane for ULP and LPG and the URBAN FUEL CYCLE of FG II Falcon
namely, EcoLPI, I-6 petrol vs Ecoboost 2.0, the approximate cost per 100 km of city driving:


EcoLPI:
18.1 l/100 km x 87.5 cents/litre = $16.19

I-6 ULP:
14.6 l/100 km x 145 cents/litre = $21.17

Ecoboost:
11.8 l/100 km x 145 cents/litre = $17.11

Savings over I-6 petrol:

EcoLPI = $5.00/100 km

Ecoboost = $4.00/100 km

I can see this ending badly for the I-6 engine if fuel prices continue to climb...

[Kevaclone]

Originally Posted by Belial

Well since the Gov added a bonus to convert to gas, the Gas converters put their price up to match.
When the Gov added a "First home owners grant" the builders put up their prices to match.

It's not always the Governments fault..... just 90+% of the time!

Exactly
We bought my Parents a Subaru Liberty 6 years ago and paid to have it converted to LPG
Quote for the LPG was $2200 but the fitter said wait 3 months for the Govt rebate, it's $2500. We thought "cool, free LPG" BZZZZZZZZZZZZ
all of a sudden the cost of the tanks has sky rocketed and we still had to kick in $700. Yeah right the tank price went up $1000

And there was nothing we could have done as the rebate only applied if you paid for or had the conversion started after the start date. It was a blatant rip off by the LPG industry that the Govt did nothing about

But this happens with every "Rebate Scheme" the Govt introduces

[IceValk85]

free roof insulations springs to mind....

Ice

[foxtrot3]

Originally Posted by Dr Smith

I think you'll find with respect to automotive LPG our lpg prices are based on Saudi Arabian contract price (Saudi CP) for propane and butance which has jumped dramatically recently. There is no parity for lpg with asian countries.

I realise you were referring to oil however the following explains what determines our automotive fuel prices where we fill up.

This ACCC article explains LPG pricing.
http://www.accc.gov.au/content/item....tive%20LPG.pdf

Petrol:
http://www.accc.gov.au/content/item....d%20petrol.pdf

Diesel:
http://www.accc.gov.au/content/item....f%20diesel.pdf

Hi. interesting thing in the petrol pricing link of yours that the ACCC mentions that 20% of our petrol is imported but they don't tell us that it is the fuel for the top end of Australia as it is cheaper to import it than ship from southern/eastern states where our major refineries are but the petrol price in Darwin is about 15 cpl higher than our Melbourne price Cheers MD

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by TMC

Hydrogen is the answer (I've seen the odd hydrogen bus around Perth).

Now all we need is someone to make a solar powered hydrogen producing machine which takes water from the ocean and makes Hydrogen, then compresses it into a tank. (I hope you're reading this oil companies. Be scared - real scared) That will mean that anyone can make their own fuel thanks to the sun, just like plants and photosynthesis. Try and tax that Gummit.

The only problem is that Hydrogen is an energy negative fuel...you simply can't get out of it the energy it takes to produce it...sorry.
Not to mention the difficulties of storing it as it needs to be stored...extremely cold and in a compressed form which takes up a huge amount of space in a car.

There's no such thing as a free lunch...

[TMC]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

The only problem is that Hydrogen is an energy negative fuel...you simply can't get out of it the energy it takes to produce it...sorry.
Not to mention the difficulties of storing it as it needs to be stored...extremely cold and in a compressed form which takes up a huge amount of space in a car.

There's no such thing as a free lunch...

That's why you use solar to do it. Even when using petrol you are using the energy that plants produced in the raw product (crude oil) that was initially produced by photosynthesis (ie from the sun). The storage thing is a bit more complex though.

All fuels we use have energy initially provided by the sun and we unleash that locked energy when we burn it. The energy didn't miraculously spring into existence.

The only fuel that doesn't run on that principle is nuclear, and I don't think nuclear fuel and cars mix too well.

[Revolver]

Originally Posted by mickxr8

Vote with your cheap chinese made pencils next fed election , sadly the "none of the above" aint there yet. best stop here

That won't do a thing. It wouldn't decrease the price. If there was an uproar on the price of it, there would be a response close to this:

"The Gilard Government failed to contain LPG prices, however, with the cost of producing, buying, & importing, I'm afraid that there is nothing that this government can do. We have exhausted every possible avenue."

Just blame the initial rise on the previous government, then go ahead and find a reason why you can't do anything for it now to keep the money rolling in. Since most previous governments have sold off all their assets there is no longer any recurring or "passive" income. So they fin every little way to tax us. We get taxed on what we earn, spend, & buy. I agree. But, Good luck.

[some_cs_student]

Originally Posted by falconnut

Glad i never jumped on the LPG bandwagon, no savings to be had now :(

LPG is still cheaper if you have already converted. But the cost of conversion is no longer justifiable :(