WA motorists could face wheel clamps over late fines

[Road_Warrior]

Western Australia, it's time to get angry:

http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/west...-1225832345140

WA motorists who are late paying fines could soon find their vehicles wheel-clamped, in a proposal under development by Attorney-General Christian Porter.

Mr Porter, who has flagged the idea previously, said today he was working on the wheel-clamp plan, in a renewed push for tougher sanctions for fine defaulters.

He said he hoped to put the proposal, which could also include plans to confiscate vehicles and the removal of registration plates, to Cabinet in the first half of this year.

It could be introduced into State Parliament soon after.

"At the moment the way in which we attempt to stop an individual using their vehicle if they've got outstanding fines is to take their licence off them," Mr Porter told media today

He said simply cancelling people's licences had failed to act as a deterrent because the "hardcore non-payers" continued to flout the law and drive.

"It's been a concern for Attorneys-General past but no one's actually done anything about it.

"One great way to stop people from using their vehicles is to immobilise their vehicles with a wheel clamp and then the choices are pay their fines or get a good pair of running shoes."

Last year more than 70,000 motorists had licenses suspended do to unpaid fines, whose value has passed $220 million.

When The Sunday Times broke the wheel-clamp story exclusively early this month, Mr Porter said present laws also allowed confiscation of defaulters' cars.

But he said this was costly and seldom used because often the vehicles had little value, so selling them did not recoup costs.

Clamping cars was a lot cheaper and could be done anywhere, including at a person's house or workplace.

The ABC today quoted Opposition legal spokesman John Quigley as pointing to possible big problems from the scheme - in particular, the likelihood of vehicles being wrongly or unjustly clamped.

Good luck getting access to my garage so you can clamp my vehicle, you bunch of Nazis.

Now, I don't have any unpaid or late fines, I haven't had a traffic infringement in years so I'm not really concerned about my vehicles being affected by this, but I'm more than a little bit concerned at this legal concept which to me is thin edge of the wedge type stuff, along with Rob Johnston's "stop and search" laws.

So are they dirty about the money (unpaid fines) or people flouting the law and continuing to drive while under suspension? If people keep driving without a licence, put them in the slammer for a month. But it seems its more about the money than anything...as usual...

[[CaSeY]]

They've been doing this in nz for ages dont see the big deal.

1. Dont get a fine in the first place
2. if you do get one pay it

[Copie]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Western Australia, it's time to get angry:

http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/west...-1225832345140



Good luck getting access to my garage so you can clamp my vehicle, you bunch of Nazis.

Now, I don't have any unpaid or late fines, I haven't had a traffic infringement in years so I'm not really concerned about my vehicles being affected by this, but I'm more than a little bit concerned at this legal concept which to me is thin edge of the wedge type stuff, along with Rob Johnston's "stop and search" laws.

So are they dirty about the money (unpaid fines) or people flouting the law and continuing to drive while under suspension? If people keep driving without a licence, put them in the slammer for a month. But it seems its more about the money than anything...as usual...

Costs more to put them in the slammer for a month, then just putting on a wheel lock.

Not to mention having a criminal mark on your record (saying that you did jail time)

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Copie

Costs more to put them in the slammer for a month, then just putting on a wheel lock.

Not to mention having a criminal mark on your record (saying that you did jail time)

The rumour goes about $50,000 a year per prisoner a year, to keep them in there, fed and their facilities. Do we really want to be throwing people in jail left right and centre? Unpaid fines deserves no jail time, things like drunken assaults at nightclubs, etc do.

Also having a criminal record means goodbye to your future job prospects, unless you want to be cleaning toilets. Instead of paying how much it is now for 3km/h over, it'd be 10x that amount when you have a bloody heap of people lining up at Centrelink because they won't lower themselves into getting jobs as things like janitors after obtaining a criminal record.

[kezzer]

Haha goodluck clamping my car. Whats the world coming to.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by kezzer

Haha goodluck clamping my car. Whats the world coming to.

Been ads on the radio about unpaid fines saying "Either you can pay the fine or we can clamp your car" in Victoria, something along those lines, keep hearing it at work.

Should get a whole heap of crappy $100 cars and get a 3km/h speeding fine, don't pay it and park them in the carpark at a government building and get them all clamped in there so no one can park there haha.

[kezzer]

hahahahaha, like at the cop station lol, whats next, forget to pay our taxes and they put you in a straight jacket?

[mrbaxr6t]

there was a thread I read about a bloke who lived in an estate in the USA they clamped his car because his permit had expired - he somehow moved the car clamp and all to his shed on his property the clamp company got most annoyed and demanded their clamp back and got the police involved he repeatedly told the guy from clam company that he can come get the clamp and clamp guy kept saying "pay the fine" he said no and round and round it went. Exposed somewhat of a loophole in the laws over there they tried to make the claim he stole the clamp but he repeatedly allowed them access to take it back but they refused because they wanted the $ to remove it. I remember them trying to use wheel clamps before the discussions got heated and wheel clamps got forcibly removed. I have so much hate for wheel clamps they take away a persons' freedom we are all free to come and go as we please clamping someones' car if you ask me is a form of espionage and entrapment somebody just wants to go where they need to in their car but they can't cause some *** has imprisoned the car. If my car should ever be clamped I will not give them one red cent I will fight them till the day I die.

[3vXT]

Makes sense to me.

1. Get fined for something
2. Don't fight the infringement because you are too lazy (and/or guilty)
3. Wait
4. Wait
5. Walk outside to find a big fat clamp on your 19's.
6. Complain and whinge to everyone about your freedoms being eroded
7. Pay the fine + late fees + whatever else
8. Get over it

I've got no sympathy for people that won't take their medicine (or won't argue their case when they are innocent) and continue to drive around unlicensed.

[Tony xa]

I can see why people are getting feed up with these new laws getting pretty dawn hard on us but I guess I would rather have my wheeled clamped in my shed .
I personlay would rather this for hoon laws as well instead of loosing your car to a impound site

[Copie]

Besides if smart man was smart, he would simply acquire an oxy torch, and proceed to melt the lock to the point where can simply knock it off.

Then remove said clamp, attach it with a fresh lock to some randoms car and off he goes.

[bodes-sh]

some people are really unbelievable, if you get fines and don't pay them you deserve to have your wheels clamped so you can't get more fines. either don't break the law and don't get fined or pay the fine if you get one. it's quite simple

[mrbaxr6t]

Originally Posted by ken2903

Makes sense to me.

1. Get fined for something
2. Don't fight the infringement because you are too lazy (and/or guilty)
3. Wait
4. Wait
5. Walk outside to find a big fat clamp on your 19's.
6. Complain and whinge to everyone about your freedoms being eroded
7. Pay the fine + late fees + whatever else
8. Get over it

I've got no sympathy for people that won't take their medicine (or won't argue their case when they are innocent) and continue to drive around unlicensed.

clearly you havn't thought this through heres a scenario - some car gets clamped a long way from home with a woman and children buying groceries at the supermarket something happens to said woman and children because she can't drive her car home, said woman and children are never seen again had she been able to drive she would not have vanished surely this potential outcome far outweighs any driving offense she may have ever committed. Imprisoning someones' car is a form of extortion it forces people into desperate situations "they need the car to get to x but dont have the money" and hence are trapped. If I was to grab some random person on the street and prevent them from leaving this is an unlawful arrest and is against the law.

Let's not go into the fact that the car gets damaged whilst you are seeking payment to remove the "clamp" who pays for the criminal damage to the vehicle? I can tell you now it wont be the clampers. It is unlawful to take someones' property from them also which in a round about way clamping does it removes them of their vehicle for a parking fine?? massive overkill mate for such a small offense.

[snappy]

Originally Posted by ken2903

Makes sense to me.

1. Get fined for something
2. Don't fight the infringement because you are too lazy (and/or guilty)
3. Wait
4. Wait
5. Walk outside to find a big fat clamp on your 19's.
6. Complain and whinge to everyone about your freedoms being eroded
7. Pay the fine + late fees + whatever else
8. Get over it

I've got no sympathy for people that won't take their medicine (or won't argue their case when they are innocent) and continue to drive around unlicensed.

Not every unpaid bill would not be paid due to lazyiness or contempt
There would families that would choose the power bills/ food / fuel bills over a parking ticket or a speeding ticket for a couple of kms over the limit .
There are struggling families around and putting a boot on there car could make life that little bit harder or worse prevent them from earning a income .

[Falcon Coupe]

Originally Posted by snappy

Not every unpaid bill would not be paid due to lazyiness or contempt
.

Receiving the fine in the first place is more than likely caused by the above.

[braddyxe51]

When The Sunday Times broke the wheel-clamp story exclusively early this month, Mr Porter said present laws also allowed confiscation of defaulters' cars.

But he said this was costly and seldom used because often the vehicles had little value, so selling them did not recoup costs.


The people who dont pay to get there car back from impound arnt going to care if its wheel clamped they will just leave it there and it will have to get towed in the end any way. So tax payer pay for wheel clamps, clamping and towage. Why not just tow it straight up.


When inspectors put a parking ticket on a car put it where the driver is going to see it.
Seen a young girl get in her car at shops near my house (free packing so ticket not from there) Ticket was placed bottom left corner of scree under wiper from where she sits wont be able to see it. Such a small peice of paper lucky to see it if ya looked at car from outside

[braddyxe51]

Originally Posted by Copie

Besides if smart man was smart, he would simply acquire an oxy torch, and proceed to melt the lock to the point where can simply knock it off.

Then remove said clamp, attach it with a fresh lock to some randoms car and off he goes.

I was thinking more of a 9" petrol grinder.

[3vXT]

Originally Posted by mrbaxr6t

clearly you havn't thought this through heres a scenario - some car gets clamped a long way from home with a woman and children buying groceries at the supermarket something happens to said woman and children because she can't drive her car home, said woman and children are never seen again had she been able to drive she would not have vanished surely this potential outcome far outweighs any driving offense she may have ever committed. Imprisoning someones' car is a form of extortion it forces people into desperate situations "they need the car to get to x but dont have the money" and hence are trapped. If I was to grab some random person on the street and prevent them from leaving this is an unlawful arrest and is against the law.

Sorry but thats pretty random and even in those circumstances, the woman is at fault.

If i don't bother to get my car serviced, i'm at a shopping centre far from home and the car wont start and i get kidnapped while walking home is that Ford's fault?

As for the 'i'm too poor to pay my fines' people, that's understandable. I was once in that situation too and when i called the number on the back of the ticket they offered me some stupidly easy monthly repayments that a homeless person could just about afford.

All this is irrelevant anyway. If this is a alternative (or in addition) to suspending someones license then they shouldn't be driving the car anyway. If someone else relies on that car for something then they should take it up with the owner/fine getter etc...

Seriously, they should name them "too bad, so sad clamps".

[mrbaxr6t]

Originally Posted by ken2903

Sorry but thats pretty random and even in those circumstances, the woman is at fault.

If i don't bother to get my car serviced, i'm at a shopping centre far from home and the car wont start and i get kidnapped while walking home is that Ford's fault?

As for the 'i'm too poor to pay my fines' people, that's understandable. I was once in that situation too and when i called the number on the back of the ticket they offered me some stupidly easy monthly repayments that a homeless person could just about afford.

All this is irrelevant anyway. If this is a alternative (or in addition) to suspending someones license then they shouldn't be driving the car anyway. If someone else relies on that car for something then they should take it up with the owner/fine getter etc...

Seriously, they should name them "too bad, so sad clamps".

yes you can't park anywhere because all the spots are in use by clamped cars - too bad so sad

parking is difficult enough already booting cars results in the spot its being parked in being unable to be used by anyone else - too bad so sad eh.... :

I am strongly opposed to the use of these as are many others and I personally cannot see how anybody can support their use.

[3vXT]

Originally Posted by mrbaxr6t

I am strongly opposed to the use of these as are many others and I personally cannot see how anybody can support their use.

I can see why people that would drive around unlicensed collecting fines that they have no intention of paying would take offense but it shouldn't be an issue for the rest of us.

The idea of car parks filled to capacity with clamped, useless cars isn't realistic. Don't they clamp cars in the US? I've never heard of parking being an issue due to abandoned, clamped cars there. Seriously.

I think the real problem is that some people are so used to automatically fighting every single idea that can in any way be seen as the government raping our liberties, that they attack the ideas that may have some merit. Someone should put a wheel clamp on bandwagons.

[braddyxe51]

Clamp it, eventully it will get towed so why not tow it first. Save us tax payers from buying 100'000 wheel clamps.
Im sure a parking inspector isnt gonna walk around with a heap of clamps.

Your are all right about people not getting into situation that it needs to be clamped but the gov do make mistakes.

[kezzer]

how hard is it to remove a clamp? I've got a grinder, oxy and some laser cutting tools at home haha.

[zdcol71]

Here we go, I see a conspiracy coming on. Obviously no legitimate reason any one gets their wheels clamped??? Pay the fine get your car back and stop moaning, better still, abide by a few rules and don't get your wheels clamped in the first place!
Ps kezzer, I gotta question your thought process,.. or lack of

[zdcol71]

Originally Posted by snappy

Not every unpaid bill would not be paid due to lazyiness or contempt
There would families that would choose the power bills/ food / fuel bills over a parking ticket or a speeding ticket for a couple of kms over the limit .
There are struggling families around and putting a boot on there car could make life that little bit harder or worse prevent them from earning a income .

Just like a credit card with 3000 days intrest free ,no deposit blah blah blah, if you can't afford, it start thinking about the consequences, lets start taking a little responsibility for our actions instead of screaming how unjust everything is!!

[kezzer]

oh give me a ****************** break, it was a joke. Unlike you're 'conspiracy' theory :

[zdcol71]

Oh Sorry... seems like everything you say is a joke!!

[bodes-sh]

Originally Posted by braddyxe51

Clamp it, eventully it will get towed so why not tow it first. Save us tax payers from buying 100'000 wheel clamps.
Im sure a parking inspector isnt gonna walk around with a heap of clamps.

Your are all right about people not getting into situation that it needs to be clamped but the gov do make mistakes.

meh, if the gov't really has to, just put a tender out for scrap metal yards like sims, etc to collect and scrap abandoned cars, that'll sort them out quickly enough...

[braddyxe51]

Originally Posted by bodes-sh

meh, if the gov't really has to, just put a tender out for scrap metal yards like sims, etc to collect and scrap abandoned cars, that'll sort them out quickly enough...

Its a good way of getting all the crap, unroad worthy cars off the roads. Why arent they doing it now instead of waisting money on trying to sell them for nothing. Then when they are sold people just dump them in the bush after they have smashed them up.

[stupa]

The problem isn't with legitimate clampings, but when the system goes awry, and it does. The wrong car gets clamped then who's problem is it? It's yours because the system couldn't possibly have failed

[Yaw]

Originally Posted by braddyxe51

Clamp it, eventully it will get towed so why not tow it first. Save us tax payers from buying 100'000 wheel clamps.
Im sure a parking inspector isnt gonna walk around with a heap of clamps.

Your are all right about people not getting into situation that it needs to be clamped but the gov do make mistakes.

Holding yard charges would be more expensive.